grace

alexandra - you - of ALL people! - GAVE them away?!? WOW! :speechless: must have been a GOOD friend!

and then there's spessivstseva. and pavlova. i must say i am surprised at HOW MANY we are coming up with... and even fonteyn's end was not what every little girl's fantasy would have wished for her - too soon, too impoverished, and probably (speculatively:) lonely.

rodney - yes. lucette appears momentarily in TURNING POINT, as odile, with bujones, if i recall correctly. the AB DQ has recently been re-something-or-othered, (much to her satisfaction), and re-released - but i haven't seen the 'new' version. i am teaching now, where the notation DOES come in handy...

rodney: ~ i WISH!!!no. sadly, i was never in that class. oh, i tried. i tried. but: no. :nopity: i HAVE danced - in much humbler settings. when i went to london, to train as a benesh notator, (the benesh institute was then right behind the RB company - tube line in-between), i was lucky enough to spend lots of time at the RB and RBS. i notated on a new bintley work, and an ashton work (when ashton was still alive & around). i watched rehearsals and company classes. i watched teachers at the RBS upper school, and i also worked one summer at white lodge. i took class with ex-RB people, like beriosova and maryon lane and lynn seymour. (i had come from training in australia with lucette aldous.) my partner was an RB dancer, so i met or knew many of the dancers who were current, then (80's to 1991) - including collier. i feel very lucky to have been there at that time, and to have met living history in the form of people like markova, de valois, etc. but to have danced in such exalted company - no. sadly not to be. :shrug:

erik bruhn? john cranko? macmillan's relatively early and dramatic death might belong in this thread category... choo san goh's loss is a massive one to contemporary (i.e. today's) ballet, in my view. beriosova's demise, after years of visible alcoholism in london, was sad. elaine fifield, the original RB pineapple poll, died here in perth (western australia), a few years back. she resolutely avoided anything to do with ballet for the last 'half' (loosely speaking) of her life.

THANKS ozzie! it was annoying me, that the word seemed meaningless/unrelated to its meaning - even after alexandra explained its meaning to me, in another thread...but now i can see that the word DOES make sense. thankyou. it will be much easier to remember 'blog' and its meaning, now. B)

i am using windows XP and IE 6. i have had the experience, several times, of starting a new thread and then NOT being able to see it, in VIEW NEW POSTS - despite repeatedly clicking 'Refresh'. on those occasions, i have come to the conclusion that my post and new thread had been lost. later - next time i log on - i see that the thread is indeed there, and other people have been looking at it and responding to it - so obviously it was only me that had the problem. i wondered if there was a time delay before new threads showed up? however, since the new threads DID eventually show up, i just decided not to stress about it! :shrug: i cannot say this has happened recently, as i have spent hardly any time on the board over the last week.

glebb - you probably also know that the classes have been written down and published, in english/french, in labanotation and in benesh notation, together with the music scores to go with the exercises, in a set of 4 soft-cover books. out-of-print, of course, but a remarkable little collection -which you might want to know about - all the same.

sorry rodney - but having watched collier a lot, i regarded 'soubrette' as one possible description of her - which was NOT to say that that was ALL she was, or that she was necessarily limited by being ABLE to be that way. about sibley and the rose adage - i honestly don't know, but i feel quite sure this is likely to have happened. it's really not so unusual, even in a class, sometimes to get a freak fantastic balance, and to find it easier to stay there, than to come down. i saw maria almeida do an equally spectacular disregard-of-the-choreography in beauty, about 15 years ago. if you liked collier, you are bound to like durante. she appears in the RB staging of beauty, directed by dowell, which is available on video. if you can't get hold of it, one day i will make a mammoth effort and get my 2nd VCR fixed, so that i can record you a copy.

kate b - i'll ask! ... i must say i AM surprised at HOW MANY suitable books WERE suggested.

funny face: i am thrilled to see that you have joined us, as i know what interesting and valuable posts you make. i look forward to your company in the TEACHERS forum, especially...

nothing to add, except just to pop in to let you know that i am appreciating some of the very sensible and intelligent comments posted here. i will make a thread over in TEACHERS for the suggestion that a school - ANY school - might do several years of vaganova training at the outset, as a base...certainly a suggestion which is worth a little critical thought ( - in general, i mean - not necessarily with regard to WSB)...

about that furball between you and the keyboard, rodney: i too have one of those at this moment. i really tried to make it a rule to *them*: 'leave me alone when at the keyboard'...but it's not working. very distracting. and, as you say, not good for posture, for typing speed or for accuracy. the variation above i will email or PM to you (although copying and pasting from my post should certainly be possible for you). a little while ago, i started a Beginners Benesh course at the board, here. if you are interested, do a search, and you should find two threads. my energy tailed off, but soon i will pick up where i left off, and go forward again.

thanks estelle. six hours is really daunting, but i too will keep an eye out for this one. was it shown in one sitting?

about the RB lilac fairy: i am not going to get out a video and see what they are doing 'now', but...these pieces of information may help. i have never been aware that ashton (or anyone else at the RB) had any hand in altering the variation that was originally taught (i ASSUME) from sergeyev's notes. but i may be wrong. after all, we all know there are TWO very acceptable versions of lilac fairy, as you have mentioned already. (i can't quite follow where you guys are getting a third one, yet - but i know that is just MY morning muddle-headedness, not any fault of YOURS!) one possibility is that the reference by croce to ashton's version, means that ashton was director of the company at the time, and that she is referring to his STAGING, his PRODUCTION, NOT his choreography. is that possible? (YOU will have to do the date-checking: that's the kind of thing i can't be bothered with.) i have copies of several Benesh-notated lilac fairy's, directly from the RB company. in 1967, the variation consists of: - commences with grand battement en rond en dedans, to tombé croisé devant into waltz en tournant (en dedans) - into chassé double RELEVE in 1st arabesque facing SIDE-stage left. - then, COUPE under, en face, onto pointe ®. double rond de jambe en dehors, fondue, pas de bourree (BSF)* to double pirouette en dehors, to pas de bourree en tournant, to - repeat the whole thing on the other side - but instead of the final pas de bourree, you land in 5th (R foot front). - 3 sissones en avant in arabesque to downstage R, the 3rd one landing in 4th to prepare for double pirouette en dehors (arms 5th en haut) - which lands in 5th (R foot front), - to enable a repeat of this sissone passage to the same side. the 2nd time, the double pirouette finishes with a turning pas de bourree en dedans, to posé in attitude croisé, to prompt corner, gesturing downstage. - fondue, a few steps into posé attitude, 3 times, making a path of travel upstage (detail omitted by me, here!), to walk to arrive centre stage. preparation for: - series of: grands battement relevé devant onto pointe, facing side-stage left - which fouetté to (high arm) 1st arabesque facing stage right, fondue/ relevé. swing the leg through en cloche to devant as you relevé, to fouetté again to 1st arabesque - this completes one full turn to the right. there's a bit more of this which i can't be bothered working out... (!) this sequence ends in a double pirouette en dedans, arms 5th, to tombé into waltz en tournant...to - repeat the grands fouetté bizzo, up to the double pirouette (same side). - finish is a pause in a pose (!), then, - on the two bars of 2/4: assemblé over ®, relevé 5th (arms 5th), detourné (left) to land preparatory pose/B+, facing downstage right, arms 2nd position palms down, head looking left = centre. make sense? i hadn't intended to write out the whole thing, just enough to identify the signature phrases that make the versions recogniseable...and since THAT was a bit tiresome, i'll do the other one, later. (don't hold your breath!) the 'other one' is Fyodor Lophukov's choreography, "as remembered by Madame Cleo Nordi, to whom it was taught by Lubov Egorova in Paris in 1923".

estelle: in melvyn bragg's interview documentary with sylvie, a few years back, it was made clear that the 'll' is NOT silent. i do however, find it rather hard to pronounce, that way!

:cat: :cat:

rodney, as your questions have become so specific, and so well-researched in advance, i am wondering whether you are perhaps writing a book? or very exhaustive programme notes? ....or are you 'just' a history buff, or someone with a passion for accuracy and detail? i hope you don't mind the direct question...?

hi mic31! i guess it might have been nice to ask the ladies' opinions also...but we can take care of ourselves, too! carbro - i was about to ask where you found that 'shushing' smilie - but i see that he is now an official one, so i won't bother. cute! dirac - first time i've 'heard' YOU say anything so unrestrained! i'll be looking out for THIS guy...

very interesting information. jane - thanks for coming up with the date. i wonder if we can find out any more about this - and whether the 1942 (WWII) timing had anything to do with the name change?

alexandra, i am unfamiliar with this story you refer to, about petipa and theatre politics - i assume there must be a 'whole book' on such a subject: either literally, or otherwise...? (maybe the ivanov biography?) would you mind starting another thread to tell me a little about this, or are you able to refer me to a previous one? thanks

thanks mel. i am not pressing you to head to your library, but i am just curious, if you remember where you read this - possibly beaumont's book 'the ballet called giselle' (which i could look up myself!!), or somewhere else? i have just always loved giselle, so all this poetic Romantic trivia is of some interest to me.

mel, can you just clarify what you mean by "originally"- i.e. what source you are referring to? as carbro says, a fascinating tidbit...

rodney: since no-one has yet replied to your post above (i am no-one!), you can edit your previous post, without upsetting anyone. i have always believed that florimund, (flor = flower, mund = world), means flower of the world - named to signify his desirability/beauty/etc. a suitable partner for aurora (= the dawn). rodney, mel: have i been too fanciful, or would you back this up? rodney: i had never thought of describing my superfluous abdominal flab as "an Antonia del'Erian embonpoint in (her) figure"... i hope i have understood you? perhaps gwendoline looks like a glorious pelican in flight - we have lots of those on the west coast here, where i live. )

forgive me for having an opinion regarding an enterprise so close to home for many of you. BUT: (!) i'm with samba - what a great post, samba! i cannot comment on the rep or the director/s, but i love some of the descriptions ("call it eclectic, call it confused" ) however, when it comes to a school approach, i can only admire mckerrow's stance. it sounds like HER training gave her a strong enough base to BE ABLE to alter her style as she wished. whereas i would IMAGINE that a purely Balanchine-style-based training might not enable a dancer to be as adaptable (as she was able to be), in their future careers. there is a BIG difference between "teaching the students some works by ...Balanchine" and "an exclusively Balanchine-based school" i don't know any of these people, and i realise some of the posters - (AND those noticeably absent) - will take this all more personally. i am only talking in generalities/ in principle, but, as i said before: i second samba's post.