grace

interesting thread, which i have only just looked in on. and i appreciate alexandra attempting to more clearly define the terms - that is essential. i don't know the answer, but would STILL incline toward london or NY. i am inclined to agree that, at present, a major event can happen anywhere. i certainly don't think THE capital can be anywhere in russia, though. sorry!

~ "nelly": :confused:

mbjerk: good post! i agree.wonderful thread. i didn't know this, and i appreciate being told. i also appreciate someone *asking the question* ~ 'big smile' to silvy, and 'wink' to cabriole...

"split soul" : :rolleyes:

thanks, Jane D.

like nanatchka, i first had to focus on the actual QUESTION, and not be sidetracked. i really appreciate your answer, nanatchka. i agree with GWTW that duncan's name is far better known by the public - and associated in the public mind with any type of dancing that's 'free-er' than ballet. graham's name, IMO, is really not much known by the GENERAL public (which is quite unfair.) my first reaction was that graham's influence on dance was not so much "as a choreographer", but more via her development of a technique which could be taken seriously in theatrical dance, as training, and then as a performance language. and THEN as an influence on balletic vocabulary. and lastly, in her actual stage choreographies, which have dated very quickly. (i am of the unpopular opinion that cunningham's have, too.) i am afraid that i am not a fan of cunningham (sorry nanatchka) - but i live in a place where it seems 'everyone' else IS. many of these people have been trained at THE local tertiary dance institution, where the head of dance is an ex-cunningham company member. (cunningham has visited here twice recently, accepted an honorary doctorate from that university, and set up a foundation for a local student to travel to NY each year, to study/work/research in areas related to HIS work - i.e. either his dance, or cage-related music studies.) so, living in an isolated small town as i do, with THIS the prevailing 'atmosphere', there really isn't any room for a visible/prominent critic to even admit to this point of view, let alone discuss it seriously! (i can call myself 'prominent' and 'visible' because it's such a small town, and there are so few critics, that one can't help but be.) therefore i appreciate being informed by articulate cunningham enthusiasts, about his work. because HERE, his genius is SO taken-for-granted, that it would be seen as terribly gauche to even discuss the basics, about the value of his work. i still hold my opinion, as i voted. i have been questioning myself, as to how far one takes the question 'WHO influenced who?'...but i see graham as SUCH a breakaway from anything that had come before. SUCH a revolution in theatrical dance. to me, cunningham is just ballet in parallel! :eek: oh god, now i've said it. i hope no-one local is reading. (it's pretty safe that they won't be!)

so, can anyone tell me about his time with martha graham? i am intrigued.

sure. but WHO influenced cunningham?

TAIWAN National Institute of the Arts in Taipei 1, Hsueh Yuan Road, Peitou, Taipei 112, Taiwan, R. O. C. Tel: 886-2 28961000 Fax: 886-2 28938711 E-mail: www@www.nia.edu.tw Web site: http://www.nia.tw THAILAND Bangkok City Ballet 59-59 /1 Sukhumvit Road Soi 49/3 Bangkok 10110 Thailand TEL: 0 2662 5020 FAX: 0 2662 5019 email: info@bangkokcityballet.com web: http://www.bangkokcityballet.com Dance Centre Sukhumvit Soi 33 Studio 53/3 Sukhumvit Soi 33 Klongton Bangkok 10110 Thailand DIRECTOR: Khun Vararom Pachimsawat Tel: 259-8861 Tel/Fax: 258-9227 E-Mail: info@dance-centre.com

just adding some other addresses, so they're all in the same place... (hope this is OK, alexandra...): AFRICA School of Ballet, University of Cape Town, Private Bag, Rondebosch, 7701, Republic of South Africa Telephone:RSA (21) 650-2398/9 Fax: RSA (21) 650-3524 e-mail: muslr@protem.uct.ac.za Technikon Pretoria Department of Dance & Musical Theatre Arts Campus (Nelson Mandela Drive) Private Bag X680 Pretoria 0001 Ms Vicki Karras (Head of Department) Tel. (012) 318-6156 Fax: (012) 318-6018 e-mail: dance@techpta.ac.za web: http://www.techpta.ac.za/tp_web/index.php?struc=177 HONG KONG HK Academy of Performing Arts The Hong Kong Academy for Performing Arts 1 Gloucester Road Wanchai, Hong Kong Susan Street, Dean of Dance email: s.street@hkapa.edu T: 2584 8539 F : 2802 3856 Admin Tel: (852)2584 8554 or 2584 8579 Fax: (852)2584 8722 E-mail: aso@mail.hkapa.edu web: http://www.hkapa.edu/asp/dance/dance_introduction.asp

wonderful, sapphirenite. thank you very much.

thanks, mel - it just doesn't 'look' like it's a complimentary word, somehow.

"mensch"?

i voted for graham. i'd be intrigued to hear the people who voted for cunningham or taylor explain what their 'great influence' was/ is - i.e. WHO have they influenced, and in what WAYS that make them *MORE* influential than graham or duncan have been?

now now guys - i told you it's too easy to be scornful of these things. however, i agree with syr about humour, and wouldn't mind seeing the spoof.

good one, marc! ;)

following on from ed waffle's thread "I Hate Television", it occurred to me - from my own perspective as someone sho lives alone - that the list of haters and appreciaters of TV MIGHT divide down the lines of those who have OTHER company at home (the 'haters'), and those whose homes are largely silent (apart for MUSIC, of course!) without it (the 'appreciaters')... what do you think? i am happy to confess that, in addition to my animals, the characters on my television 'people' my home. therefore i choose what i watch carefully! and i REALLY appreciate television. i guess i am asking all of the people who 'hate' or scorn or dismiss television: is it perhaps, to some extent, because there is a lot of competition for your attention, in your home-life? don't get me wrong: i have lots of other things to do - but i often have the TV on at the same time, sort of 'for company'! TV-lovers are welcome to respond also.

just delving a little further into this. PISA stands for The OECD PROGRAMME FOR INTERNATIONAL STUDENT ASSESSMENT. sorry for the long quotes, but i hope 'you' might be as interested as i am, in this. PISA is a "new three-year survey of the knowledge and skills of 15-year-olds in the principal industrialised countries. - The survey, conducted first in 2000, will be repeated every three years. - 265,000 students from 32 countries took part. - Students sat pencil and paper assessments in their schools. - Students and their principals also answered questionnaires about themselves and their schools. This allowed PISA to identify what factors are associated with better and worse performance. - PISA was co-ordinated by governments of participating countries, through the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD). - Leading international experts worked to develop an assessment whose results are comparable across different national and cultural contexts."

ari: SO important, isn't it ari? ;) re michael batchelor (who i never saw): when JaneD says "sadly missed", i THINK she means 'from the stage'? (hosking is no longer with us, and freeman: i don't know about, in this sense.)

ah! NOW i see. when i accessed this thread VIA 'Recent Posts', i failed to notice that it is in the NON-ballet section of the board. so: now i understand.

in another thread, there is a post about some controversy or other, related to nin's diaries. i bookmarked the site referred to, and went there today, to read what it was all about. but the site doesn't seem to work at all. none of the links go anywhere. this is the link: http://www.salon.com/weekly/bair960729.html is the person who provided that link still around? did you check the links at the site? - i.e. do you know if the links worked at the time? - if so, i will just try again another day... or is there another good source for this info? anyone know?

i am trying to imagine my mother's criteria. *MY* criteria would be : only ballet books, & NO fiction at all !! also of course, i do take her shopping for books - so i see, out of the books i pass to her, what she actually looks at, and what she rejects out-of-hand! i think she has read 'ya-ya sisterhood' . i will take a note of the others. thanks!

JaneD - you and i must just have very different taste, as i DID see Sea of Troubles, and was troubled by how forgettable it was! (especially given that it was quite a coup, for dance advance to get a macmillan gift of that nature). that aside, however, and not meaning to turn this into a 'sheriff' thread - i recognise your meaning about freeman in a balanchine work, & agree with you. i can picture some of the things you describe sheriff doing, and your words do bring his abilities to life. thanks.

thank you mbjerk - i was only thinking the opposite: that one didn't want to 'insult' a COMPANY by suggesting that their dancers might need to (win money to) pursue more training! melodies - that is a wonderful list. is there any chance you could find postal addresses, or email addresses for any of these? i am afraid that if *I* phoned them to ask for such information, maybe i would only get someone who speaks mandarin!

i'm sorry to nitpick - and i don't want to start a controversy - but how come "Who's the Most Influential 20th century choreographer" equates to "who do you think is THE most influential modern dance choreographer?" ~ or did i miss something? given the options, it appears to me that the question is ONLY the second one - not the first. is that fair comment? :confused: