BW

Isn't this along the same lines as asking if A Tale of Two Cities is still something worth while to have on our reading lists? And perhaps this is why the Christian religions decided not to use the King James Version anymore - on to the common denominator of the Revised Standard!:rolleyes: Estelle, I think here, we too, think of "politically correct" in a negative way! It's all about keeping up the appearances that are currently deemed acceptable isn't it? I'll be back to check the rest of the responses after I ponder my next answers.

Isn't this along the same lines as asking if A Tale of Two Cities is still something worth while to have on our reading lists? And perhaps this is why the Christian religions decided not to use the King James Version anymore - on to the common denominator of the Revised Standard!:rolleyes: Estelle, I think here, we too, think of "politically correct" in a negative way! It's all about keeping up the appearances that are currently deemed acceptable isn't it? I'll be back to check the rest of the responses after I ponder my next answers.

OK. that settles it! I'm going by dates only!

Thank you Calliope for your comments. Now, I just have to find my program guide.

Today, the NY Times reviewed this program. I posted it under the links section: http://64.247.33.2/~atom/forum/showthread....=&threadid=5329 Ms. Kisselgoff agrees with much of what has been written here...but not entirely - she actually felt Mr. Bart's ballet, "Peches de Jeunesse served the students well...or visa versa.

My, my, can we have a bit more here? I am contemplating buying some tickets too, and I know nothing about the Kirov's individual dancers. However, it's not often that one has the opportunity to see Le Bayadere, so I'd love some more details on casting choices. I am also considering some of their other performances... Am I crazy to consider Jewels?

Wow Giannina, that is a bunch of ballets in such a short time! Happily, I, too, had the pleasure of watching Friday night's performances by ABT of The Dream and Symphony in C as well as meeting up with you and a few other Alertniks. I enjoyed Ashton's distillation of Shakespeare's Midsummer's Night Dream and loved the final pas de deux between Titania (Allesandra Ferri) and Oberon (Ethan Stiefel). And, as an aside, I hear that one awkward move was removed for the next performance! However, as much as I really love Shakspeare's tale - and it is one of my favorites - my heart belonged to Symphony C, that night. It was then that I knew I was a goner, hooked forever. Seeing these dancers perform on the Met's stage what I'd seen them attempt at City Center was an eye opener! I will not brook anyone's criticisms ;), for I loved every second of Balanchine's piece along with Bizet's music. For me, Nina Ananiashvili was the high point and yes, I am also a sucker for Angel Corella. Many thanks for bringing it all back to mind, Giannina - and I'm so glad to hear you had a wonderful time with NYCB as well!

Unlike the rest of you, I did gain something from her piece, however I am but a lowly neophyte in this Byzantine world of ballet:) Dale, thank you for wrapping it all up so well. Leigh, Alexandra, Ari, dirac, Calliope, Mel, atm, Farrell Fan, stan, kfw, Bobbi, glebb, and Brymar - I've gotten a great deal from reading your posts, too. Okay, so if Ms. Homans, who danced with PNB and is apparently writing or has written a book on classical ballet, has truly not offered those with experience and longevity anything new, then where does one go from here? What's next? What do you propose to do about airing your own views in regard to her article? Write a letter to the editor? Write a nice note to NYCB? Not waste your breath? Actually, I am not meaning to sound "flip" - but for those who have the experience of watching this company over the course of many years, and have mentioned your concerns about various aspects from coaching to training, what happens next? Something? Nothing? I'm not suggesting that NYCB is an organization built on the "will of the people" or that it has any democratic leanings within itself as an institution, but how are changes made? Generally speaking who are the people who have enough influence to effect change? Is it the board of directors? Or, do you think that this too shall pass and that New York City Ballet, along with its School of American Ballet, shall evolve on its own, all in good time?

Unlike the rest of you, I did gain something from her piece, however I am but a lowly neophyte in this Byzantine world of ballet:) Dale, thank you for wrapping it all up so well. Leigh, Alexandra, Ari, dirac, Calliope, Mel, atm, Farrell Fan, stan, kfw, Bobbi, glebb, and Brymar - I've gotten a great deal from reading your posts, too. Okay, so if Ms. Homans, who danced with PNB and is apparently writing or has written a book on classical ballet, has truly not offered those with experience and longevity anything new, then where does one go from here? What's next? What do you propose to do about airing your own views in regard to her article? Write a letter to the editor? Write a nice note to NYCB? Not waste your breath? Actually, I am not meaning to sound "flip" - but for those who have the experience of watching this company over the course of many years, and have mentioned your concerns about various aspects from coaching to training, what happens next? Something? Nothing? I'm not suggesting that NYCB is an organization built on the "will of the people" or that it has any democratic leanings within itself as an institution, but how are changes made? Generally speaking who are the people who have enough influence to effect change? Is it the board of directors? Or, do you think that this too shall pass and that New York City Ballet, along with its School of American Ballet, shall evolve on its own, all in good time?

Bobbi, why is it that you say so definitely Why does this have to be true? I really don't believe it has to be so at all. There are quite a number of former dancers from Balanchine's era who are still more than alive and kicking who could easily be invited to work with the current company members. However, I do think your remembrance of Patti McBride's saying how it was that Balanchine communicated the subtle nuance of that particular move - of using her hand as though she were "begging for money" is truly the kind of detail that makes all the difference in the world...visually speaking. I know from my own limited experience of watching a rehearsal during which the choreographer, or the experienced dancer in the role if it is not a new one, has shown the tiniest detail in the way the fingers are held or the angle at which the wrist is bent, or the slightest change in the angle of the head...changes the whole effect. I found Ms. Homans' article to be very interesting and well written. Yes, there was a great deal of history thrown in...but I've seen pictures of some of the Russians with their flowing scarves and the references she makes to George Balanchine's history is important. I think in reading this article one must remember that not everyone is up to speed on the history of the New York City Ballet. Actually, I found it rather refreshing...to see someone be so direct. Is she correct? I couldn't possibly say. I only know what I've seen myself and what I've heard from those who performed at NYCB while Mr. Balanchine was still alive. But back to the initial idea that there is real value in bringing in dancers who danced in the originals or, at least, in the versions danced while George Balanchine was still alive. As someone posted, this observation is not new. This being said, why is it not generally done?

Bobbi, why is it that you say so definitely Why does this have to be true? I really don't believe it has to be so at all. There are quite a number of former dancers from Balanchine's era who are still more than alive and kicking who could easily be invited to work with the current company members. However, I do think your remembrance of Patti McBride's saying how it was that Balanchine communicated the subtle nuance of that particular move - of using her hand as though she were "begging for money" is truly the kind of detail that makes all the difference in the world...visually speaking. I know from my own limited experience of watching a rehearsal during which the choreographer, or the experienced dancer in the role if it is not a new one, has shown the tiniest detail in the way the fingers are held or the angle at which the wrist is bent, or the slightest change in the angle of the head...changes the whole effect. I found Ms. Homans' article to be very interesting and well written. Yes, there was a great deal of history thrown in...but I've seen pictures of some of the Russians with their flowing scarves and the references she makes to George Balanchine's history is important. I think in reading this article one must remember that not everyone is up to speed on the history of the New York City Ballet. Actually, I found it rather refreshing...to see someone be so direct. Is she correct? I couldn't possibly say. I only know what I've seen myself and what I've heard from those who performed at NYCB while Mr. Balanchine was still alive. But back to the initial idea that there is real value in bringing in dancers who danced in the originals or, at least, in the versions danced while George Balanchine was still alive. As someone posted, this observation is not new. This being said, why is it not generally done?

Many thanks for bringing up the form and structure underpinnings! Having very little musical background, this discussion is really quite helpful. Me thinks, I now understand why Manhattnik has that little quote down below his name - some dances are too long and now I am beginning to understand why...thanks to this discussion!

Thank you Clarisse! I thoughy Noelle did a beautiful job - and that she really looked as though she were enjoying herself too - which always makes any performance even better. I give them much credit for performing under difficult circumstances - and, again, I am truly glad we were able to attend. I wonder, Clarisse, if you know how they felt about their time in NYC?

glebb, I think you description sounds rather interesting and wouldn't have minded seeing it at all. I kind of like the idea of the older Julilet coming out of the mirror... though the stripping of the costumes might have been too much. Did the 3 Juliets and Romeo do this shedding of their mortal skins as well?

After the last two nights of very different ballet performances and having both cyber and noncyber chats with balletomanes extraordinaire:D, I've started to think, again, how great it would be to take a course with a really knowledgeable and really good teacher with whom one could watch videos of ballets, (yes, live would be better - but annoying for other audience members) read the history, discuss what was going on in the world at the time the piece was originally choreographed, from a cultural, political, etc., point of view.... Sort of like the Comparative Arts Course I took long ago in college...but, this time, it we be ballet centered as opposed to fine arts centered. I'd say it was about four years ago that I decided it was time to start taking my young daughter to see dance regularly. We started with a Junior Membership to The Joyce in NYC, and added a sprinkling of NYCB and ABT here and there...Then I began subscribing to Winter NYCB and Spring ABT...with Lincoln Center's Summer Festival dance thrown in from The Bolshoi and Kirov to Merce Cunningham. Since my offspring has serious aspirations, I have thought of our tickets as part of her education...and along the way, I've turned into an addict myself. As luck would have it, my husband enjoys it too...although he has been generous enough to hand over his ticket to a ticketless friend on occasion. (Don't think I would ever be so kind!) Many who post here are highly educated in ballet and dance in general. Some are professionals as either dancers or choreographers...some teach some do not... Some apparently grew up on the ballet as their "mother's milk" and then, there are those of us who, for whatever reasons, are relatively new and unschooled. How do we learn what makes a ballet "good"...and I don't mean the subjective parts! There must be some subjectivity involved, right? Obviously, up here in the New York region there are diehard NYCBers and their counterparts who adore ABT. What are the neophytes to do? There are two books that I've found really helpful: Ballet 101: A Complete Guide to Learning and Loving the Ballet by Robert Greskovic and Classical Ballet Technique by Gretchen Ward Warren Both of these books are excellent and can be purchased through our handy Amazon site, above, but I need more! How does one learn to see when one does not or has not danced? Do I need a set of head phones with Leigh's voice, real time, giving me a play by play? ;) Or maybe we could have different channels to choose from Victoria Leigh on Channel One, Alexandra on Two, Leigh on Three, Manhattnik, Calliope, Andrei, Kevin, Farrel Fan, Aubri, Estelle, Katharine, etc., ad infinitum, on our satellite connection? Just reading my "review" ;) of the POB students vs the other's shows from whence we come. Does anyone have any suggestions or comments? What are your methods?

Estelle and aubri thank you for your posts and for giving some more background on the students, as well. Alas, I guess I'm not as an experienced wine connoisseur - perhaps that's why I enjoyed their performance so much - give me one really good glass and I'm set. And Leigh, thanks for not going after me for my inadvertent Titantic allusion!;) I hope the students gave a better performance on their second night and that they enjoyed their visit to New York. Haven't seen today's paper yet, to see if they were reviewed in the press or not. It would be interesting to know if anyone here attended the Friday night performance.

Laura Hecquet danced the lead in Western Symphony and she was also one of the soloists in Peches de Jeunesse. Agreed, she was obviously their star, and her partner Josua Hoffalt was the young man who stood out among the very good "bumper crop" of male dancers, nevertheless my feelings about last night's performance remain the same - guess that's what makes an audience, eh? Interestingly, I really loved the first piece that you both obviously found wanting. To me it was it was visually dramatic - I loved the tutus and thought it looked good. I also thought the young woman in the excerpt from Bejart's Sept danses grecques was very good and didn't detect an iota of nervousness there. Personally, I felt that the young man who was her partner was at a disadvantage due to his lack of height. Interestingly, although I agree that Laura Hecquet was excellent in Western Symphony, I just didn't "like" that piece. I probably wouldn't like it even seeing NYCB's top dancers perform it...just not my taste. So no one commented on Coppelia, Act II - or upon Charlotte Ranson, who played Swanilda, and did a superb job...I didn't notice any technical flaws (not that I necessarily would unless they were obvious...I will have to ask my own resident critic about that later today) - and I thought they did a great job with the character dancing and the mime. To me, Mademoiselle Ranson is a winner - and I couldn't take my eyes off of her even when she was in the corps of their final piece Peches de Jeunesse. I know there probably were certain dancers who didn't do as well as one might think they should...and if my resident ballet dancer were sitting here she might agree with some of the points you, Leigh and britomart, have made... Yes, there were a few shakey moments but the good ones far out weighed them, in my eyes. All in all, it was a night to remember for me - as well as for the others in our group who attended. Where's all my high school French, when I need it?;) To each his own, as they say.

Tonight I had the distinct pleasure of attending a performance by the students of the Paris Opera Ballet School in NYC. This was surely one of the highlights of my ballet going experience. My daughter exlaimed that she'd rather see them than NYCB or ABT any day. They were amazing, astonishing, technically beautiful and not without personality to match! The program combined several different styles of ballet and even one modern piece. Someone with more expertise, please help me out here! Tell everyone why these dancers were so phenomenal! Their eppaulement, their legs, their perfectly arched feet, their stage presence, their ability to mime and their joy in dancing - all were truly astonishing. I am guessing that the age range was about 14 or 15 to 18? I am not sure if tomorrow night is sold out or not - if not - get thee to thy phone and get a hold of some tickets!!!! I know it was sold out tonight and, believe me, they deserved to be! !

Just a post script here: I always bring my binoculars - auto focus, extra wide field of view! I have to see the dancers' faces, and if I can't I am very, very unhappy!

SABkid, never you worry! I love the Workshop Performances and find the energy level inspiring, to say the least! The year before last, when I attended in order to see a relative perform, one of the lead ballerinas slipped and fell but it all happened so fast that many in the audience missed it...and guess what? She was offered a position at Miami City Ballet! So listen to your "elders" here and enjoy yourself because it's a wonderful time for all. And,'merde' to you, SABkid!

Rather than choosing to continue the term "glamour puss", I'd choose to use the adjective glamorous, instead. Although I am not a long-termer at the NYCB, I have to admit that I've always enjoyed looking at Ms. Alexopoulus. I have heard that she bore some injuries that prevented her from giving her roles her all in recent years. That being said, I will miss seeing her. Personally, I find Jennifer Ringer to be gorgeously glamorous and find her to be refreshing amidst many who hue to a more androgynous look ... This speaking strictly based on appearances... Yet, I've seen Ms. Ansanelli perform in pieces that made me fall in love with her, too! Eva Natanya is lovely as well, both on stage and off... I can't help but wish she might be given some different types of roles which might allow her to "show more of her stuff"... Obviously, I prefer the more feminine dancer, generally speaking. As for Valentina Kozlova, I never had the pleasure of seeing her perform while she was still with NYCB, however I have seen her a number of times since then, in both classical and contemporary ballets and, although she is definitely still a dramatic beauty, she is also a master technician who consistently manages to leave one nearly breathless.

Ideally, I like to sit about where you like to sit Doris..depending on how big the theater is. I like to try to sit just a bit above the stage level...but don't want to hear the foot falls, or see the sweat - unless of course it's with my trusty binoculars! Once I sat on the first ring, but on the right side of the NY State Theater and I didn't like it too much...it was for a Merce Cunningham program and I couldn't see enough! Today I just ordered some tickets for NYCB up at Saratoga Springs...and a really nice, helpful fellow at the box office spent quite a bit of time with me explaining why he liked to sit where! He also told me that the main reason he works at SPAC in the summers is because he can attend any performance from ballet to classical music for free! One performance we attend will be in the "balcony box" row A...supposedly right in the center! the other will be in row O of the orchestra. I've never been up there before so it should be interesting to have the two different views. If, however, I am at a performance in which the stage is at floor level, I prefer to sit a little less than half way up the tiered seats. Granted these are my ideal seats! Actually I am thinking of going for the "Fourth Ring Society" of the NYCB next year, and follow some of the other posters here who then move down after intermission...if I can get up the gumption to do it! ;)

If a dancer, such as Makarova, can no longer do the 36 fouettes as the Black Swan, does that mean she should no longer dance it at all? Is it always an all or nothing situation in ballet? I just experienced "star power" this past weekend while watching Valentina Kozlova (retired NYCB '95, now in mid forties) perform Odette/Odile and she still was able to leave us asking for more. This time she did not, however, make it to 36...but I still basked in every minute. I have also seen her perform several contemporary pieces by Margo Sappington and have found myself close to tears for her beauty, sensuality and ability to transport an audience to another plane. If a ballet dancer, for example, can no longer handle 36 fouettes is it time to put the swan's crown away for good and go with other ballets that don't have mandatory feets of stamina like this? From my point of view, I could have cared less if there were 36, 32 or 28! Ms. Kozlova still knocked my socks off.

If a dancer, such as Makarova, can no longer do the 36 fouettes as the Black Swan, does that mean she should no longer dance it at all? Is it always an all or nothing situation in ballet? I just experienced "star power" this past weekend while watching Valentina Kozlova (retired NYCB '95, now in mid forties) perform Odette/Odile and she still was able to leave us asking for more. This time she did not, however, make it to 36...but I still basked in every minute. I have also seen her perform several contemporary pieces by Margo Sappington and have found myself close to tears for her beauty, sensuality and ability to transport an audience to another plane. If a ballet dancer, for example, can no longer handle 36 fouettes is it time to put the swan's crown away for good and go with other ballets that don't have mandatory feets of stamina like this? From my point of view, I could have cared less if there were 36, 32 or 28! Ms. Kozlova still knocked my socks off.

Thank you all, so much, for your reviews. I'm only sorry that I was not able to attend. Reading about it, from all these, sometimes, different points of view is the next best thing. Farrell Fan, your comments on mortality were very moving. {And Manhattanik you are "naughty" critic...but quite witty:) ;)}