Victoria Leigh

What a wonderful and delightful idea! I need to think about this one, though, in terms of casting. I'm assuming we can go back in time here, and cast anyone we feel would have been able to realistically portray one of these characters, whether they are dancing today or not. This opens up a world of possibilites....but I need some time on this one!

When the Washington Ballet does programs for children, like the morning Nuts shows, or the performances of things like Wild Things and Peter Pan which are geared for young audiences, the Artistic Director, Septime Webre, teaches them in his opening speech about Bravo, Bravi and Brava The children love knowing the difference, and you can hear them responding appropriately at the end of the show.

When the Washington Ballet does programs for children, like the morning Nuts shows, or the performances of things like Wild Things and Peter Pan which are geared for young audiences, the Artistic Director, Septime Webre, teaches them in his opening speech about Bravo, Bravi and Brava The children love knowing the difference, and you can hear them responding appropriately at the end of the show.

I just checked Alibris, and both of the above books are available there, plus several others on the romantic ballet! There were a number of copies of the Migel book available.

I just checked Alibris, and both of the above books are available there, plus several others on the romantic ballet! There were a number of copies of the Migel book available.

The websites for rare books are Alibris and Bibilofind, which is part of Amazon. (Links sent to you via IM, since I can't seem to do that here.) The Balletinas is by Parmenia Migel, published in 1972 by Macmillan Co. Another book you would like is The Romantic Ballet, from Batsford Colour Books. (B.T. Batsford, LTD) Intro by Sacheverell Sitwell. It is a small book, published in 1948. I also found that in a used book store. It's mostly just the lithographs, with some text. But lots of wonderful pictures of the lithographs.

The websites for rare books are Alibris and Bibilofind, which is part of Amazon. (Links sent to you via IM, since I can't seem to do that here.) The Balletinas is by Parmenia Migel, published in 1972 by Macmillan Co. Another book you would like is The Romantic Ballet, from Batsford Colour Books. (B.T. Batsford, LTD) Intro by Sacheverell Sitwell. It is a small book, published in 1948. I also found that in a used book store. It's mostly just the lithographs, with some text. But lots of wonderful pictures of the lithographs.

Unfortunately, I think it's probably out of print. But, the good news is, I found a copy in a second hand book store a couple of years ago. I had a copy from years ago, maybe 70's, but it sort of mysteriously disappeared when it got loaned out, so I was most delighted to find this copy. You might try Amazon, and there is another site that has old books, and it was listed here on the board somewhere, but I have forgotten now what it was called. I might have it bookmarked....will check.

Unfortunately, I think it's probably out of print. But, the good news is, I found a copy in a second hand book store a couple of years ago. I had a copy from years ago, maybe 70's, but it sort of mysteriously disappeared when it got loaned out, so I was most delighted to find this copy. You might try Amazon, and there is another site that has old books, and it was listed here on the board somewhere, but I have forgotten now what it was called. I might have it bookmarked....will check.

Glebb, do you have Parmena Miguel's book called "The Ballerinas"? It has bios of the Romantic era ballerinas

Glebb, do you have Parmena Miguel's book called "The Ballerinas"? It has bios of the Romantic era ballerinas

Just an aside to Bobbi. You can edit your posts by clicking on the Edit button at the bottom of the post We all do that a lot when we see the typos after we send the post!

ballet_lover_nc, there are forums on the board specifically for students to ask these kinds of questions. Check the Teens and Special Groups categories to see which forum applies to you. There are Young Dancer forums, a Men's forum, and an Adult Ballet Students forum. There are also a number of topics in the Archives about stretching and strengthening.

In terms of the 32 fouettés, I would consider it gauche mainly because I haven't seen anyone do them well in so long I can't even remember. It's gauche because the audience will applaud if someone just survives them, not because they are well executed. They don't seem to care if the working leg is turned in, the foot flopping, or the arms look like the dancer is doing karate instead of ballet.

I certainly think of it in terms of your first definition, Alexandra. To me it would be the dancer who is a classical stylist with a pure, clean, well placed and very solid and consistent technique who is appreciated by the public as well as dancers. The difference would be that the dancers might just be more aware of why this dancer is so special, whereas the audience just knows that he or she is wonderful! There is a similar thing with a teacher's teacher. Students will recognize (sometimes) a really good teacher, but other teachers will KNOW this is an exceptional teacher, someone they can still learn from, and why.

PK, Sweet Honey in the Rock is touring with the company! When and where are you seeing it? They left today for PA, but I'm not sure where they go next. They have several cities on the tour.

Very good way of putting it, aubri Making "stars" out of 12 year olds has nothing at all to do with the making of a dancer/artist.

BW, the age thing is hard to really answer, because there are always rare exceptions to almost everything. However, generally, children of 11, 12, and 13, even those with a great deal of talent, are still not advanced dancers. They are talented potential and should be doing work suited for their physical and technical development at the time. The classical variations were created for professional soloists and principal dancers. They are very difficult. We have a talented 12 year old who attended another school prior to coming to our school last fall. The other school was big on entering competitions, and the director of that school entered this child in one of the Grand Prix regionals this year, even though she is now a student at our school. The mother called and asked for coaching for her on one of the Paquita variations, one which is difficult for our most advanced 16 and 17 year olds! While this child is very talented, she is absolutely not ready to be doing this kind of work! (Not to mention asking to be coached at our school when we have not entered her in this competition! We do not enter students of this level, even if they are exceptionally talented. But that is beside the point of this topic.) If they are going to have 12 year olds competing, then they should, IMO, be doing things choreographed for them which are suitable for their technical abilities and physical maturity. Variations on pointe for students who have only been on pointe a year or so are not generally appropriate, in my opinion of course. Another big problem of this competition is that 15 year olds are in the same category as 18 year olds, and the Juniors range from 12-14. There is a huge difference between those ages, in both categories, in terms of physical maturity and strength. Just a few more reasons why I don't much like these things ;)

It would be hard to even decide on a favorite from this list, much less a "best" I just don't think one can pick one best out of a list of great choreographers any more than we can say that one great composer or one great artist is "the best". While I may prefer Puccini or Verdi instead of Stravinsky, Monet instead of Picasso, or Tudor instead of Balanchine, all of those are just a matter of personal taste and have nothing to do with their greatness. Sorry, Ballet Nut, just can't make a compeition out of this one. (But then, I tend to have a teeny problem with competitions in the arts anyway ;) )

Good question, Ronny To me it is movement based on the technique and vocabulary of classical ballet, danced by exquisite and beautifully trained dancers, set to music that is listenable, and put together by someone who knows how to take the music, the dancers, a set or backdrop, and lovely costumes and pull it all together into something we want to see over and over again. The work might have a story and it can be a comedy, a drama, or a romantic fairy tale. Or, it can be purely expressive of the music and totally abstract. But it must have form and reason. It can have movement that is representative of a country, called National or Character Dance, and it can take the classical vocabulary and use it to create a work based on a particular idea or period in history (Billy the Kid, Rodeo, Fancy Free, for instance) by making the balletic movements appropriate to the people in the story. This question is difficult to answer because it is, of course, a matter of opinion. There are a lot of works being called ballets today which some of us might not consider to be "real" ballets, but then others do. When the vocabulary of the work is based more on modern dance technique or jazz, for instance, is it still a ballet? Is it a "contemporary ballet" as opposed to a "classical ballet"? If so, is it still a "real" ballet? Well, I guess my answer to that is, sometimes ;) I have seen contemporary works which I would certainly put in this category, but then there are a lot which I would not. If I hate the music and think that the movement is ugly, if it is violent or extreme and the dancers are rolling on the floor and beating themselves up and being thrown around, then I would probably not consider it a ballet. But then, that would be only my opinion. Sometimes it just comes down to whether it is a good ballet or a bad ballet, but other times I have walked out saying 'this was not a ballet'. I think that the impression that the site is about "real" ballet may come from the original intent that it be about ballet only, as opposed to other forms of dance such as modern dance, jazz, hip hop, tap, ballroom, etc. But your question opens the door on the question of what we consider ballet, so, those are just my thoughts on this lovely April morning.

Glad you bumped this one up, Leigh, as I had missed it the first time Billy The Kid was in ABT's rep throughout my tenure there. I was fascinated with it, especially the opening and closing march. Until I saw that from the audience though, I did not really appreciate it. Doing it did not really give you the same sense of it's importance and, I think, it's choreographic genius. Actually the impact of the whole ballet was very different from the front, perhaps a lot more so than other ballets. At least for me. My appreciation for this work grew over the years, perhaps because learning it and dancing in only certain parts of it never gave me the same sense of the whole work as when I was able to watch it later, after having only danced in it. The lead roles were danced at that time by John Kriza, Ruthann Koesun, and Bruce Marks as Alias. Johnny and Ruthann were, I felt, very special in this ballet. But the whole work was different from anything I had seen or danced before. It was not particularly difficult to dance, except for the counts in the gun battle! I was thrown into that late in my first season, and my first performance in it was at the White House! It was a special performance, on the tiny stage in the East Room, during the presidency of JFK. It was a reception for the President of the Ivory Coast and his strikingly beautiful wife. We were flown to DC from New York for the day, and it was quite an experience. We were taken to the White House to rehearse during the afternoon. (Trying to fit that ballet onto that stage was quite a feat!) Then we were given some rooms at a nearby hotel for the rest of the day, as the performance was not until late, following the dinner. After the performance there were photos taken on stage with the company and the President and Mrs. Kennedy. Then Jackie herself took us on a tour of the White House! We were still in costume So, Billy the Kid has a very special place in my memory, aside from it being a wonderful ballet!

Simone, there well may be just as many excellent dancers today, or even more, but, in my opinion, a lot of the works they are dancing are not as good, and, even in the classical repertoire, there seems to be a severe lack of good coaching. There is too much emphasis on tricks, jumping and turning, and not enough on the ballet itself and the artistry of the dancers. Everyone today is a medal winner from some competition or other, and extreme technique is becoming the norm. While I am not against multiple pirouettes and high jumps, or even high extensions if they are well placed and appropriate to the ballet, when the ballets become ABOUT this instead of about the art of ballet, we have a problem.

Perhaps when the original was not an icon of an era, or a brilliant show or ballet to start with? I have seen updates of shows that respected the original and just made them a bit better (Cabaret comes to mind!), but have also seen things that seem to me to be sacreligious to change. My favorite show in the world has always been Showboat, perhaps because it was the first show I ever did, but also because of Kern's music. The latest production on B'way, a few years ago, made some changes that really did not work for me. It was overall a pretty good show still, but it was not the show I know, so, like with a beloved and lasting classic ballet, some things should just not be messed with!

There are some posts on other threads that are a bit more tolerant, in terms of recognizing that these schools have a place in society. They are great for recreational dancers, and people who want a lot of fun and performing experience. As I said before, the problem is that some of the dancers from many of these schools, I will not say all but I do think it is most of them, do not realize that they are not being classically well trained, and then, if they try to go to a professional school or a summer SI at a professional school, they are either not accepted or they are placed in a very low level class. Many are taken off of pointe because they never should have been there in the first place, with far too little ballet technique in their former school. They might be strong, and have a lot of performance experience, but very rarely do they understand placement, use of rotation, articulation of legs and feet, positions of the body, line, etc., etc. I'm sure there are probably some exceptions to this out there somewhere, and perhaps you are at a school which is an exception.

Interesting question, Leigh. I'm not sure if one can really know this without having worked with a director personally, but it seems to me that there was a great deal of accomplishment and positive word about the work that the late John Cranko did at Stuttgart. His early death was devastating to the ballet world as well as to his company, however the body of his work to that point, and the good name and prominence of the company were major accomplishments. Who knows what he could have done had he not died so young. Historically, I would have to think that Bournonville was a superb director. And of course there is Balanchine, MacMillan, Ashton, DeValois, Rambert.....but again, superb is relative and people who actually worked with them could very well have other ideas ;) Does "superb" deal with their body of work, or the building of a company, or how well they worked with the dancers as well as with the board and supporters and the designers and management people, or does it expect all of the above? Most of us can only know what we have seen in terms of results, and therefore superb is based only on the works they presented and the dancers and designers that they hired. All have made mistakes of course, but were they outweighed by the successes? Does their personality in terms of how they worked with the dancers and others have anything to do with it? I don't know, I'm just rambling here, trying to determine if there is such a thing as a "superb" director! ;)