Hans

Sorry--I meant to say that in my original post, what I was expressing was the idea that one can dance en pointe without studying ballet. (I've had my share of Dolly Dinkle experiences too, and in a pretty direct manner at that. ) SAB, in fact, still listed "toe" classes on its schedule when I went there, and I think we can agree that it does not separate the idea of pointework and ballet, nor is it a Dolly Dinkle. I love the "odd recital" pun by the way--that describes it perfectly!

Well yes, I know she doesn't really care about any of the princes, and giving/throwing away their flowers communicates that, but then why does she suddenly adore that bouquet? If one considers Aurora's internal dialogue, she's essentially saying, "Eh, roses. Here mom, hold these for me would you?" and then a few minutes later, "OOH! Flowers! Thank you Humpbacked Crone!"

I've been thinking about this scene for a while now, have seen it done essentially two ways, neither of which satisfies me. The way most ballet companies handle this scene is to have Carabosse simply hand Aurora the spindle. Aurora, not having seen one before, is enchanted with it and dances about as the courtiers try to take it from her until she pricks her finger. I don't like this approach as the courtiers have to sort of halfheartedly snatch at the spindle (it would be rather embarrassing if one of them successfully took it from her...I wonder what would happen in that case!) while standing in a nice neat semicircle, and it never looks very realistic. The Kirov takes a different approach--Carabosse hands Aurora the spindle hidden in a bouquet of flowers, so the courtiers don't suspect anything until Aurora pricks her finger and Catalabutte finds the needle. However, my problem with this version is that Aurora has just been given a total of eight flowers during the rose adagio, which she either handed off to her mother or tossed on the ground. Why then would she be so enamored of a bouquet given to her by some old lady she doesn't know? Has anyone seen this scene done more effectively?

Perhaps someone on the board knows when the Bolshoi acquired Le Corsaire--if it was a long time ago, that could account for some of the differences considering the various restagings the ballet would have gone through. There is some additional dancing in Act I for Medora that I wouldn't mind seeing kept as it appears to be Petipa (although just as much of it seems to be "after" or "in the style of" Petipa) and you are right, the incidental music between the two productions is completely different--different, IMO, beyond the inevitable variations in who uses which particular version of the score. Act I in particular is like a completely different ballet besides the "set pieces" of the Pas d'Esclave and the Pas de Trois des Odalisques. (Even the choreography for Gulnara differs between the two versions, but one can't always be picky about that.) Maybe Doug or Mel knows something?

Well, I've never seen Monotones, but I've also never seen a ballet that absolutely requires a dancer to do anything involving more flexibility than a split on the floor (and that's rare). Are the positions in Forsythe's work truly so extreme that it would be entirely impossible to perform his ballets without exceptional flexibility? One certainly doesn't have to raise the legs much beyond 90 degrees to dance Petipa, and even in Balanchine, while higher extensions are more desirable, one could still dance his ballets without being unusually (for a dancer) limber. What you describe regarding the grands jetés is exactly what I noticed in Le Corsaire, and it bothers me that such sloppy dancing is now going to be what people think of when they hear "Russian technique," "Vaganova," or "Kirov." :rolleyes: I suppose anyone who wants to see Vaganova technique anywhere near properly done is going to have to go to UBA.

According to the ebay site, bidding has ended for this item.

I just thought of a ballet that more people will credibly think is bad that I enjoy--Maurice Béjart's création mondiale from early 2002. If I just saw it "cold" I'd probably hate it too, but some of my personal friends and classmates were in the original cast...and I really do find many of the concepts quite interesting.

Puccini did some rather strange things in his operas. For example, he has Manon Lescaut and Des Grieux die in a desert in Louisiana. Perhaps the Louisiana topography has changed a good deal since the early 20th century. :rolleyes: In terms of ballet, I really like Le Corsaire even though the plot is utterly ridiculous, I love it anyway.

I like that lunch one, Amy. Maureen Miller of Loudoun Ballet used to say "When in doubt, do entrechat-six!" (And that was her advice to the girls.)

No, it's not that. It's the idea that one can dance en pointe without studying ballet.

Haha, sandik the Baltimore Opera has some like that...they proclaim La Sonnambula "The sleeper hit of the year," as well as some others I can't recall.

I did notice, sandik, that their pointe technique was rather awful in that section.

Perhaps it was because there wasn't a company in the west that had the resources to do it until Makarova and Nureyev came along.

Actually, ABT's production does not come from the Kirov, but from the Bolshoi, via Boston Ballet. I agree that I'd like Vikharev to reconstruct Corsaire...if such a thing is possible.

Alexandra, Baltimore Opera still uses that slogan! We've all heard "Dancers Turn Out Better" I often use this one as my AOL Instant Messenger icon: "Support the Arts--Hug a Dancer!"

In that case, I suppose it may be yet another disturbing Kirov trend...does anyone know if they've always stood that way? I have to admit that I have a tough time believing they'd be let out of the Vaganova Academy with such an obvious flaw...besides, wouldn't they have to lengthen in order to do pirouettes/generally dance en pointe? Perhaps they only lengthen when en pointe?

I meant more along the lines of dancers actively distorting the classical line in order to raise their legs higher. Re: the Kirov's knees--isn't that how hyperextended knees always look? If you look closely, you can see that the knees are not relaxed and "locked back;" rather, the kneecaps are pulled up and the lower quadriceps are engaged.

Ooh, I'd forgotten about this thread I'll only post two, I promise! "Toxic: The Britney Spears Ballet" (And you thought those bikini-top tutus in Le Corsaire were revealing...) This next one would really be a popera instead of ballet, but I couldn't resist: La Bohèmian Rhapsody: The Metropolitan Opera sings Queen

Wouldn't it be Irina Belotserkovskaya? There would also have been about five or six NYCB ballerinas with the last name "Balanchine."

For a good description of high extensions and how they relate to style, see the reviews of the Kirov on Ballet.co's message board. Also, has anyone noticed this type of high extension taking over other companies? I'd be surprised if the Kirov were the only one doing it.

All right, after reading that thread on Ballet.co, I simply must see Lopatkina as Odette! Unfortunately the Kirov has already brought Swan Lake to the Kennedy Center recently...I wonder when they'll bring it again, along with the restored Sleeping Beauty. Mashinka, I wonder if Lopatkina dyed her hair to have more of an effect onstage?

Oops, I see Pamela and I were posting at the same time. Here is my original post: Well Bart, there is classical Spanish dancing, which is a completely different form of dance than ballet, so I guess some of those companies aren't being entirely misleading.... Silvy, that's rather terrifying! Here's a fun, true story: At the local dancewear store one day, a group of girls from an out-of-town studio came in wanting to buy pointe shoes. They ended up buying shoes several sizes too large, as well as foam-rubber pads to put inside. When asked where they studied ballet, they said, "Oh, we don't take ballet. We just do toe."

Bart, the "toe dancing" expression is still used by some people, but presumably your mother only studied toe/pointe after several years of regular technique class in flat shoes. The line in my first post was a reference to the way at some "schools," students learn to dance en pointe without having any experience with ballet technique.

Yes, it was a very long time. I'm surprised no one could think of a solution sooner.

The American Dance Institute in Rockville, MD offers good-quality recreational training.