Alexandra

Okay, I'll bite I actually think Roland Petit's "Carmen" is NOT a bad ballet. Not a great one, but "very good for what it is." But saying that at a dance critics' conference causes lots of sniffs, and people suddenly remembering that they need to feed the meter. So I'll say "Carmen." It's got a great pas de deux, two great roles and three good small parts, solid construction, and it's a crowd pleaser. So it's a superficial treatment of the book -- it gets to the heart of things! Great topic, Bart. Hope there are other brave souls out there....

A few years ago, the Baltimore Opera had a slogan "Opera: It's Not as Bad As You Think. I proposed a counterpart, in the spirit of clueless marketeers trying to reach the Masses: Ballet: It's Not As Bad As Opera!

Thanks, Dale -- I didn't look at the site, just that one page, saw the "bolshoi.org", and didn't remember the company site's URL. Then it's not odd at all that such an article would appear there. Good, bad or indifferent, I'd like to see their "Le Tricorne."

A friend just sent me a link to this article on the Bolshoi's site. http://www.bolshoi.org/Pressa/massine.htm It is, well, an attack on Ratmansky -- odd that it should appear there? Or not.

I'd vote with the "that was funny?" crowd. If I were a "clueless" fan, I think I'd insulted, to boot. Who's being "classist?" The ballet, or the critic who assumes everyone else is too dumb to get it? (OR maybe he really does think like this....) Not complaining -- thanks for posting this, Hans.

There's an interesting piece in the Washington Post today about the hit summer shows about dancing (not ballet, of course). And the prognosis is for more. I haven't watched any of these. For those who have, what do you think? I'm all for a comeback of ballroom dancing. The traditional path for boys to ballet once was through ballroom dancing classes. The teachers would watch for musical, gifted little boys -- 8 and 9, too young to know that ballet was Not Cool in American schools -- and lure them into ballet classes. The article doesn't touch on this, of course, but it's worth a read. Might as Well Dance

I think some of us may have felt lucky

Can't help, I'm afraid, but you've certainly made me curious!!! Poul Gnatt left the Royal Danish Ballet 1950-51, I think. It's possible that he's using selections from the Bournonville Schools, or other classroom material that he would have known, from those years. (Much of "Conservatoire" was preserved because the enchainements were included in the Bournonville Schools by Hans Beck.) I'll try to check on this (I'm in touch with a Danish dancer from this era.) I remember you'd posted earlier about several classes being a part of this version? I'm guessing that Gnatt may have been trying to use the ballet as a teaching tool, and so essentially made up his own version. You may already know this, but Poul Gnatt was Kirsten Ralov's brother. Ralov was an expert in the Bournonville steps and style, and put out a wonderful collection of the Bournonville Schools -- four volumes, one in Labonotation, one in Benesh, one of the piano scores, and one with the steps written out in English.

The live performances in DC were also "cut," as it were, so it's not that they cut out scenes to make the DVD. They cut the production in all casts -- not just the cast that was filmed -- for the Kennedy Center performances. Don't know if that helps, but at least you know that a scene you liked isn't lying there, languishing, on the cutting room floor!

Certainly for the women. Did any of the men of her own class suffer? Ethan Frome is the only man I can think of who joined the women in hell. The rest lived, at worst, in purgatory, and most in oblivion. Hell! Purgatory! Oblivion! = a perfect Act II Oberon, in the original "Giselle" Bathilde, Wilfrid and the whole hunting party came in, found Albrecht, and took him home.

Merce Cunningham presented a major revival, Ocean, at the Lincoln Center Festival. Nancy Dalva reviewed it for DanceView Times: Oceanography

"Concerto Barocco" was once in black "bathing suits" (practice dress) but they weren't Gucci, I'm afraid!

Natalia, you should take bets

Now, Edith Wharton's production of "Giselle"....THAT would be interesting She devised such lovely hells for her errant lovers!

For Gautier, Albrecht was the protagonist, and Hilarion was the villain. In "Beauties of the Opera and the Ballet" Hilarion is referred to as "vile knave." I think that Albrecht became Bad and Hilarion Good in the mid-20th century. I don't know who was the first to play Albrecht as a cad; I think it was one of those things, like Siegfried's problems with his mother, that were in the air during the post-War rethinkings of 19th century productions. The choreographer, Coralli, was the first Hilarion, by the way, and had 13 mime scenes. (An interesting Danish footnote. "Giselle" was never popular in Copenhagen -- even today. "La Sylphide" is the great Romantic work, and James the great Romantic hero. "Giselle" remains foreign. It was staged at the Royal Theatre in Copenhagen during one of Bournonville's leaves of absence -- I think when he was in Sweden, but I'd have to check. When he came home, he threw it out. I asked Henning Kronstam once if he knew why, and he said, as though they all talked about it 'round the water cooler fairly often, "I heard it was because he didn't like it that the hero was a liar." For Bournonville, a hero couldn't lie.)

Yes, exactly. Like the rare dancer who can make "classroom steps" look like dancing

Yup. I will play Devil's Advocate to my own post, though, and say that sometimes I think money IS a factor, a big one. Most contemporary dances are for small casts (easier and cheaper to rehearse than large-cast works) and works that have minimal or no pointe work save on shoes. I'd also say that I think repertorial changes are artistic director driven (and should be, whether I agree with what they're doing or not) not the result of audience feedback. There are some companies now that may have segments of the audience (subscribers or not ) who want to see mishmash dance more than classical ballet. (And I fervently wish there were more mishmash dance companies for them to patronize but I've never read of a city in which subscribers rallied to push out classical or neoclassical ballet.

I think that the crossover dance is what programmers THINK will attract new audiences. And the usual retort to that one is, if you're trying to attract people to the ballet who don't like ballet, what good are you doing?

NOTE: I've copied this over from Ballet Talk For Dancers. It's intended to be a very general overview of ballet history written for Young Dancers. But some of it may be of interest to people here as well. We've restricted the forum on BT4D to young dancers and their parents, but others who would like to discuss, ask questions or contribute are welcome to do so here. After the "Ballet Comique" (1581) and the death a few years after it of Catherine de Medici, the ballet was less splendid and less popular than it had been in her court for more than 50 years. Catherine's heirs did not have her artistic taste, and the ballets were smaller in scale and didn't have the same grand ambitions -- there were political satires and masquerades, but not the spectacles that Catherine had presented. Ballet rose again, though, in the middle of the 17th century with Louis XIV, the most powerful king in Europe. He's not very popular in books that tell the history of Europe -- he was an "absolute monarch," which means that anything he said became The Law, and so he's not someone that most people today view very sympathetically. BUT for ballet dancers, he's got a lovable side: he loved ballet. He was a very good dancer. AND he started the first ballet school. He is, in a way, why we're all here. Ballet had begun to be important again during the reign of Louis XIV's father, conveniently named Louis XIII. (XIV is the Roman numeral for 14, and XIII is the Roman numberal for 13, and it's the way Kings were named, if one took the name of a prior King.) The advisors to Louis XIII -- Cardinals and other high Catholic Church officials from Italy -- knew ballet and, like Catherine, understood that it could be used to show the court's power, and for propaganda (to send a message that the King wanted to send in an artistic way, but a way clear enough that everyone understood what he meant). Louis XIII made his official court debut, when he was 13 years old, in a ballet. He got to pick the ballet -- the plot, the music, the design, the role he wanted to dance, and could cast the other roles as well. The ballet was called "The Deliverance of Renaud" and the young king did not play the hero, Renaud, but a fire demon. Ballet was popular during his reign, but when HIS son, Louis XIV, could oversee the court entertainments, then ballet really flowered. Louix XIV is often called, in general history books, The Sun King, and the usual explanation is because he was so powerful, but that's because they don't know ballet history. Louis XIV made his debut in court ballets when he was 12, and when he was 14, was Apollo in "Le Ballet de la Nuit" (The Ballet of the Night), and Apollo was the God of the Sun. In the old myths, Apollo, who was the son of the chief God, Zeus, harnessed his horses to the sun and drove it around the earth, so he was a very poweful god! As part of his costume in the ballet, Louis had a headdress that looked like the sun's rays. Apollo was his favorite role, and the Sun King became his nickname. In betwen battles, both in war and in court politics, Louis's court also gave very lavish entertainments at the palace of Versailles. Two very great artists worked in this court: the musician, Jean-Baptiiste Lully, and the choreographer, Pierre Beauchamps. Beauchamps is credited with inventing, or at least writing down, the five positions of the feet, and on turn out. (Dancers used the five positions, and turn out, before, but it was Beauchamps who codified them -- made them necessary to ballet. A choreographer would set dances that had the dances move from position to position.) Lully did more than write the music for the ballets; he produced them. He looked back to ancient Greek theater, which had been made up of poetry, music and dancing, and the ancient idea of harmony -- that no one part dominated, but that everyone worked together in the service of the Idea of a particular ballet. Louis XIV was known as a fine dancer, as well as an absolute monarch. There's even a step named after him -- the royale. But even Kings eventually get too old to dance, and Louis stopped when he was about 35. (Some say because he was getting fat, others because he made a mistake while dancing, and if you're The Absolute Monarch, you can't make a mistake in public.) When he stopped dancing, he did something very wonderful. He started the Royal Academy of Dance in 1661. This wasn't a school as we think of it today, but an Academy in the sense of bringing together all the major teachers so they could work out a way of teaching, setting down the steps and agreeing on the way that the steps should be taught, what the names of the steps were, and the like. In 1669, Louis founded what, after a few name changes, we now call the Paris Opera, a house for the performance of both opera and ballet, and for the training of artists. While there had been a few professional dancers in the court performances to dance roles that were considered inappropriate for nobles to dance (and required more virtuosity than the noble amateurs could muster!) when ballet began to move out of the court and into theaters professional dancers were needed. There were already private dancing teachers working in Paris, teaching steps and etiquette (good manners) to aristocrats and those who wanted to acquire aristocratic manners. There were also professional entertainers -- dancers, jugglers, acrobats -- who did not dance "in the noble manner;" they weren't court dancers. But they were very good dancers and, with training, could learn the noble style necessary to perform the ballets. They also were much more technically developed than the gentlemen amateurs who danced at court, and brought their virtuosity into ballet. (For the first few years, women did not appear on stage, but by 1681, there were female dancers.) Louis XIV was so powerful that whatever he did was imitated all over Europe, and soon other countries had theaters and academies as well. Next: Early 18th century ballets: ballet moves to the theater.

Dale, thank you so much for posting that link. I bought it, and got it in two days! (express mail) It's a live performance from 1980, complete wiith all the curtain calls. I thought it was very well filmed for a life performance. They're both. ...well, they're over 40 and it's a fight. But you see the artistry and the detail in both their performances, I think. And who could resist a peek at a Bathilde named Patrizia Lollabrigida?

Thanks, and thanks for the link, MiinkusPugni. The conductor -- it's Peter Ernst Lassen, is it not? I was told that, but haven't checked it -- is regarded as THE pre-eminent Bournonville conductor. He gives a flavor to the music that no one else does. (I wish I had his "Coppelia" and his "Giselle" too.)

Experimental dance NEVER sells -- which is why Kourlas is suggesting that a production like Balanchine's "Don Quixote" should be done at a festival of experimental work, not at an opera house with an audience that thinks it's going to see the "real" "Don Quixote," no matter how many articles explaining the production there are in the papers. Kourlas isn't comparing classical ballet to experimental work, but what she considers to be pseudo-experimental work (crossover dance) to work that is truly experimental. I think there's a lot in the article to discuss. I know we've had a lot of conversations over the years about pop ballet, crossover dance, etc., but we haven't in awhile. I have two quarrels with crossover -- the first, and one of the points for founding this site, is that it's not ballet. If they want to call it contemporary dance, fine! That's a different issue. But all the c**p that it's "firmly rooted in the classical tradition" and "taking ballet to where it's never gone before," which I've been reading for the past 30 years now, I find maddening The second, which is what Kourlas's article deals with, is the nature of the work itself, no matter what you call it, and she finds if superficial and banal (among other things -- it's worth a read). But I gather from Bart's post that he disagrees -- and I'm sure there are others. What do you think?

Thanks for doing this, Hans. I was about to do the same thing. Here's my original post. It's not very detailed, because the forum on BT4D is aimed at the young dancers and we're (trying to) limit participation in the discussion there to young dancers and their parents. (If the discussion gets too detailed there, people may read it, but probably most 14 year olds wouldn't post on it!) This is open to all, and there's a lot that can be added to this intro, so please feel free. (I'm not going to copy over other's posts from the BT4D talk, because it will look as though they're all posted by me, but if anyone wants to make the same comments, please do.) An Outline of Ballet History People have danced as long as there have been people, in all countries. But ballet began in late Renaissance Italy, developed first in Paris, then in other European countries, including Russia, and, in the 20th century, America as well. This is a brief outline of ballet history, so you’ll have an overview of its development. Renaissance Court Beginnings The first ballet dancers were members of Renaissance courts -- including kings, queens, princes and princesses and members of the aristocracy. There were no professional dancers as we know them today. Ballet dancers still walk like Renaissance courtiers, with an erect spine and head held proudly -- and this is why. Ballet evolved from the social dances that courtiers danced regularly. They were taught the steps by dancing masters. The dances developed from the “folk dances” that ordinary people danced, but became more difficult and more refined. A courtier was expected to be a good dancer, as well as to play a musical instrument and be familiar with literature and art, and especially the great myths and the literature of ancient Greek and Rome. (They were educated in, and able to read, Greek and Latin.) In addition, men were trained in fencing and the arts of war, women in embroidery, and both genders in horseback riding and etiquette. The dancing master taught the steps, and both men and women practiced daily. The center of fine art in Renaissance Italy was at the court of the de Medicis, an extremely rich merchant family who bought its way into the aristocracy. They were great patrons of the art, and some of these merchant princes had very good taste, as well. A daughter of the house, Catherine de Medici, married into the de Valois court of France. When her husband died, she ruled as Queen of France until her son was old enough to take the throne, and her court is where the first flowering of ballet occurred. The balls, where these social dances were danced, had gotten more elaborate over the years. People came in costume, or wore elaborate masks. (It’s worth noting that their clothes would sink a battleship. Some dresses, including the many petticoats, weighed 30 pounds or more, and when you added the jewelry, these tiny women were burdened by about 50 pounds of clothing and jewels. The men’s dress was also heavy. They liked rich fabrics and needed many layers of clothing, especially in winter, because the stone castles were as cold as meat lockers. The men regularly wore suits of armor, for fighting and training -- not when they danced, of course, but their bodies were accustomed to being weighted down. When you read now that a danseur noble (the dancer playing Prince Siegfried in “Swan Lake,” say) has a sense of weight, that sense of weighted movement comes from this era. The noble and serious dancer, man or woman, danced “the stately measures;” they danced slowly with great control, to show off those clothes as well as the lines of the body. By the middle of the 16th century, dancing, poetry and music were combined in court entertainments in emulation of the theater of ancient Greece. (The famous Greek tragedies included singing as well as dancing by a chorus.) . The court dancing masters and musicians and other artists put together entertainments based on the stories of the great myths (the tales of the Greek and Roman gods and heroes, like Venus, goddess of love, and her husband Mars, god of war). These entertainments were the forerunners of both opera and ballet; they contained singing as well as danced “intermedii”. The dancers (still all courtiers) were costumed appropriate to the myth being dramatized, but their dancing did not further the action. It provided an interlude -- like a modern day divertissement (the fairy tale character dances in the last act of “Sleeping Beauty”). The ballets -- and they were called “ballets” at first, not “operas’ or “dramas” -- took place in a palace’s great hall. The spectators sat around all four sides of the dancing floor, and at the end of the evening joined the dancers on that dancing floor in the social dances of the day. The emphasis in the choreography was the patterns the dancers made, not on individual virtuosity; this is called “figured dancing.” (Think of contemporary square dancing, with everyone wearing Shakespearean costumes and dancing slowly. I think that’s as close as we can get.). The patterns, as well as the poetry, was very symbolic, with references to mythology and literature, hidden meanings buried in the text and gestures, that were very sophisticated. The spectators all had the same high educational level and would understand -- or at least, could be expected to understand -- the allusions. Catherine was interested in art, but she also realized that these entertainments were very useful as a display of power. They were obviously very expensive, and often were used to celebrate an occasion -- the marriage of a Prince, or the signing of a treaty -- and other rulers would be invited to watch. If a country could spend this much money on a night’s entertainment, what would they spend on war? In 1581, Catherine de Medici commissioned a lavish entertainment lasting hours called “Le Ballet Comique de la Royne Louise” (“The Dramatic Ballet of Queen Louise;” “comique” meant “dramatic” then, not “comic.”) and this is considered the first ballet. There had been similar entertainments before this one, but scholars picked “The Ballet Comique” for the history books. It was in honor of the Duc de Joyeux’s marriage to Marguerite of Lorraine. Here’s a good description of it from Carol Lee’s “Ballet in Western Culture:” “The spectacle’s thematic material was the classical tale of the evil enchantress Circe, who with ‘unrivaled grace,’ mischievously interacted with gods, goddesses, and gentlemen whom she transformed into beasts, satyrs, dryads and naiads all of whom were presented in a series of intermedii, or entremets, as they were called in France. . . .The ‘Ballet Comique’ has been summed up as an original and unique mixture of French taste and Italian theories on classical drama.” The production was the responsibility of the court dancing master, Balthasar de Beaujoyeulx (born in Italy as Baldassare da Belgiojoso), and he gets into the history books as the first choreographer.

Natalia, I'd wondered the same thing about Ratmansky. This is just a guess, but perhaps he'd made the commitment to be a judge at NYIBC before he'd been named Bolshoi Director?

A quick note on Balanchine and extensions -- my understanding is that he liked what a particular dancer had. If someone had a high extension -- Allegra Kent, Suzanne Farrell -- he used it. But he would also tell a dancer who was imitating Kent or Farrell, "That doesn't suit you." Unfortunately, I think students will imitate what they SEE rather than do what they're told, and they make the mistake of thinking that it was the high extension that mattered -- that Balanchine was creating on Kent or Farrell because of that extension. Which leads to the "If I have a high extension, I, too, will be a ballerina" conclusion. (Noverre writes about this problem -- the illogical logic, not the extensions.)