SanderO

Yikes, Some women just got me on the phone and tried to get me to purchase NYCB tix for their winter season. Fine and dandy. So I asked who is dancing in what? I like to select ballets and see principals. I've done that with the ABT. She says NYCB does not announce casts until the day before a performance. Could this be? If so, it sure puts the emphasis on the choreographer and not the dancers. If this was not true.. the NYCB has a rather aggressive marketing approach. In either case, I am turned off. One thing I do like, these days, is becoming familiar with a dancer, especially with the benefit of the comments on BT and then going to see these dancers to see what I see. Do I agree do I see something else? BT is full of discussions about dancers and that is one of the draws for me, not JUST the ballet and the choreography and the sets. She told me to go for a single ticket the day of the performance. What gives with this NYCB marketing? Is this approach new?

Music and dance is like a river which stretches through time, perceived at an instant, yet each instant is different, never the same, and always connected to what came before and will come after. An interesting aspect of dance photography is the inherent implication of time which I think is impossible in music. You can see the flow captured in an instant. I suspect (not being a dancer), that skillful lyrical or adagio dancers can support the thread of time weaving through their movement in perfectly fluid transitions from one instant to the next.

Helene, So these collaborations are "cobbled together" from the "outside" and not actually mini ballet companies inside of the opera company?

Can this be a multiple choice question? hahaha

Today, I just happened to be at a biz meeting at 11am across from Lincoln Center and I passed a throng headed into the Met. I stopped someone and asked where everyone was going. Dress Rehearsal of Madam Butterfly was the answer. Damn...and I had to go to a meeting. When that was done I walked over the Met and it was intermission and I went in to the ticket taker and asked him what I could do to get in. He reached in his pocket and gave me a ticket to row B center grand Tier. WOW... talk about luck! At the next intermission I spotted Beth Bergman who is an opera photographer talking to a lovely women. I politely interrupted to thank Ms Bergman for something and joined in the conversation. I was introduced to the other women who said she was a former ballet dancer for the Met. That made sense as she had a dancer's body. But that got me thinking. Is the ballet in the Met Opera productions more akin to formal ballet or like Broadway dancing? I have seen dance in Met Opera productions... like the Zeferelli La Traviata, but I never thought of it as ballet. So my question are... What is the dancing at the Met Opera... how is it choreographed etc. Do they outsource the dance or have an in house company? Is there any "real ballet" in opera?

It's a double edged sword. You create a new "thing"... try to get lots of PR and attention and then invite all sorts of criticism which inevitably will follow. I generally am attracted to more humility.. that is.. geniuses going about their work and being discovered by others... not their own PR. Time will tell.

I understand that ballet and opera companies have huge wardrobe departments. But do dancers ever actually own their costumes?

Are dancers lyrical or are dances lyrical? Or do lyrical dancers dance lyrical dances?

Of course much of our emotions is conveyed in facial expressions and people varying in their own range of facial emotions. But acting is also gesture and so forth and these are part of movement and the body and would be the province of ballet training. I see what appears to me as some decent acting at the ABT. I assumed it was self taught but there was some sort of coaching in there. Anyone???

I agree with Marqa in that these are performers and not people doing acrobatics. They have to have a knack for acting and "emoting" to get the principal roles... don't they? I don't know that acting is taught or not... who would teach it? Dance instructors or acting teachers? Don't we all learn to act a bit just by having to navigate through social situations?

Story ballet and acting skills is a strange journey into "fiction". These stories are crystallized into a few hours of dance, sometimes spanning long periods of time, with no or no character development, of course no dialog except some mime perhaps. We bring a lot to the performance by knowing in advance the storyline and view the performers as providing little vignette interpretation of a plot, along with the emotional energy that the characters might be experiencing. Most is expressed in abstraction - dance and many of the stories are "fairy tales" which are quite the stretch from reality to begin with. They're beyond fiction... their fantasy. To experience a story ballet both from the audience perspective and from the dancers perspective is to enter into a completely different realm of fiction or fantasy or storyline. We carry over concepts from all sorts of other literary and artistic experiences. We are expected to read between the "lines".. make all sorts of assumptions and leaps of faith and to conclusions. I know little about the history of ballet and how a ballet story was intended. I don't care as long as the dancing is beautiful and these artists can create some sort of illusion I can be pulled into for a few hours. For me it is 99% about beauty and form and how the human body can be a means of communication without words. Sure, emotions imply relationships and storyline and we may want to force more logic to what we are seeing. But really... it's all fantasy. I can't cry for what a character is experiencing as others do... I could cry perhaps because it is so beautiful. That's ballet to me. But I know nothing about it.

I can certainly appreciate that they don't want to make a presence here for obvious reasons. But I would imagine that many would read here as it is quite an interesting resource and a way to get the pulse of the ballet public... so to speak. I met an ABT fan when he asked me if I was a supporter or member... I was wearing an ABT T shirt out in LI entering a breakfast place. We chatted for a few minutes and he goes regularly and often but had never heard of ballet talk. Perhaps he will be a new member? I can't imagine that the dance world would not be readers of this site. I can't even recall how I found it... Google? Diversion over.

Slightly OT... do you think that people in the companies, dancers and so forth read Ballet Talk?

I see very little "tension" in the hands of female dancers. Am I missing something? I do see what appears to be energy flowing from them is a rather serene way. What sort of "training" do ballet dancers go through concerning their hands? Are their "formal" positions and "moves" as there are steps for the body? Or is the hand positions always a part of the larger body step or movement? I do love the delicate way dancers in some ballets "point" to themselves and others. Sorry for the loss/absence of words to articulate my thoughts.

Wife and I are the reverse. I love to attend ballet and opera, she feels it's "bourgeoise" (sp?) She prefers ballet, but often passes because she is too tired from work and I have to find someone else to join me... usually not a problem. I always prefer what I am seeing and what I am not seeing. I feel that there are too few performances... that I can afford and have the time to see... so each one is very precious to me. I envy the ballet talkers who have seen many performances of the same ballet over many years and have deep and broad understanding of the work and the dancers who perform it. I don't think I will have the opportunity to acquire such wisdom. I will say that one definitely get out of a theater experience what one is willing to invest in terms of knowledge. The more you know about a genre, the richer the experience will be. Ballet Talk has augmented my ballet experience enormously and I am indebted to the many unseen "geniuses" who share their wisdom so generously. Does anyone know if there is an opera discussion group of a similar nature to Ballet Talk? One other note about BT... the posters here are amazingly knowledgeable about all the arts and few seem to be completely narrowly focused on ballet or dance. I like that.

I don't much experience observing hands, but Julie Kent is one of my favs for sure. I think 4mrdncr describes the feeling Julie Kent can convey with her hands. Is there a "position" for relaxed hands in repose so to speak? Can someone describe it?

Mods, please feel free to quosh this or move it... Hands are one of the most expressive parts of the body. I personally have been attracted to them and fascinated by them long before I had an interest in ballet. I always loved the hands of Michelangelo's David in Firenze for example. But dancers take hands to a whole new level of beauty and expression. They seem to often be the "place" where the final bit of "energy" flows off the dancer. And of course they are used to hold another dancer and so forth. I imagine dancers learn what do with their hands etc. because most of them clearing have the most graceful looking hands I have ever seen... in repose. Poor hand gesture or whatever it is called can spoil an otherwise wonderful movement, but a perfect one really is something to behold. I would like to hear other's comments about dancers and their hands. Who has the best hands and uses them well. What choreographers put more emphasis on the hands and so forth. Let's discuss hands.

Another interesting museum experience is the newly added to by Renzo Piano JP Morgan Library a former residence off Park Avenue in the mid 30s (NYC). It has a delightful cafe, a fabulous book shop and some interesting art and musical manuscripts. The old library itself is a gorgeous room. It's a tiny museum and well worth a visit.

What I was trying to get at... is that this is a rather prominent part of the body, very visible in most dancers (bunheads), but I have never heard of someone say..."she has beautiful ears!" I've heard too big, etc... but what ARE beautiful ears? Is there such a thing? They do frame the face and so much emotion is conveyed with the face. I am sure that ears can DETRACT from an actor's work... or for that matter a dancer's. As I noted, I usually don't see ears... they are more like the wihite background of a page. Your interest is on the text. I think ears are rather individualistic looking, like hands or noses or eyes. I do find my dogs ears cute however... and very perky.

Gene Schiavone has a great series up of curtain calls. Have a look.

I know this has nothing to do with dance, but the aesthetics of ears are almost never mentioned. Despite all the earrings to adorn them, ears are often ugly appendages. Usually I don't even "see" them. But occasionally they stand out, usually for the wrong reason - they are unattractive... usually large or sticking out or something. It's also a part of the body we can't do much with. They just are there. How do you feel about the aesthetics of ears?

Although we can't avoid perspiration from vigorous exercise, it often detracts from what we are trying to do. Of course it IS cooling our bodies and so we is providing a very vital function. We can assume that dancing under hot lights would only add to overheating and perspiration. I would have thought that some of the more "advanced" theaters would have designed HVAC systems to reflect the need for cooler temperatures on stage. I don't know that this would solve the "sweat problem" but it might mitigate it a bit. Athletes and dancers require their body and muscles to be warmed up so perhaps performing in "cold" environments is not advisable. Perhaps some dancers can comment on the optimal conditions temperature wise. There are many reasons to NOT sit up real close to the stage... and flying sweat is right up there at the top.

Printscess, Of course when we speak of the "perfect" form or beautifully proportioned dancers, one cannot think of them as statues, but how they move their bods. What I was trying to get at, is that body form does impact on how a body can move and perform in ballet and that would then underscore the notion of beauty. If you look at just the arms and the hands, it would seem that form must follow function and that disproportionately short fingers or arms simply couldn't "move" in the most fluid way they should. Does this make sense?

Perhaps some dancers could comment on how one's weight distribution body type might actually impact on their "performance". What problems do tall dancers have.. sort ones etc. From a purely physics point of view a small and more compact dancers would be able to "spin" faster. Can someone comment on this? And do you think that the movement is ballet is designed for a specific body type?

Pretty to me makes me think of someone's face or their clothes. Ferri did not have a conventionally pretty face, but thought it was beautiful. We need god to weigh in on this... it's all her fault... we have things such a beauty and perfection. Ask her.