balletforme

I do think that the aesthetic in Russia is way thinner than here. Just follow a few dancers living and working in Russia and you can see the trends.  To be a ballerina is to be ultra thin.   I don't really know that culturally eating disorders are considered as serious there? I don't know.  But they don't seem to see the pathology?  When you see a 23-year-old who looks like they are 14, then there is an eating issue. 

And watch pictures that COMPANIES actually post.  Unfortunately, they also send mixed messages. 

I want to hear an artistic director say, "If you have a documented eating disorder, we will not cast you until you get help. "

"I'm sorry you feel that way. .. "

"I'm sorry that ___ interpreted that way. . ."

Is NOT an apology. But it's a very clever, device to make the person think  he/she is hearing an apology.  It's slimy IMO. 

Truth

It feels to me as though Clifford is kind of "throwing"  these dancers under the bus?  

I think that an AD is so much more than artistic. .  .and you really need to have solid management and administrative experience. You just do. It's a business . NYCB's budget is over 65 million. You are putting someone in charge of a multimillion dollar business (510C3 but still). 

What does her dancing look like? Is she ready?  Thinking that just hibernating in a serious  coaching and rehearsal space is what is needed???? 

Hope it works!

At the risk of saying the Emperor has not clothes, I would venture that, Musicality at the very basic level, to me, is being in sync with the music.  Dancing with the music.  In the most musical dancers there is a brilliant "illustration" of the music by the dancer. 

I have to agree with the very unfortunate quote  re: It's not about entertainment. I have to believe there was something quite meaningful that must have come after that. It's like a resturant owner saying, "It's not about food."  

And aren't there many others that the world likes to see?  Like Peck (the article does not name Peck) or Pite or some Balanchine?  Why didn't she say Balanchine.  I mean most companies do some Balanchine.  Also what the dancers want is quite frankly immaterial as well. 

DC is such a different audience than NYC, Boston, Miami. . . . It's government. 

19 hours ago, On Pointe said:

There is very little supervision required in  New York for stage children of any age.  When she was starring in Annie on Broadway at age eleven,  Sarah Jessica Parker used to take the subway and the bus to the theater by herself.  In California,  you have very strict rules on movie and TV sets regarding hours worked and on set education,  but not in New York.  At any rate anyone old enough to be an apprentice at NYCB  is too old to be supervised.  The reality is nobody chaperones seventeen year old kids working in fast food either.

Actually kids all over the city use public transportation Bus and subway to get to and from school.  The schools issue tickets. 

And NY Child Labor laws are pretty robust, as are the regs governing supervision, schooling, rehearsal hours, etc. (Know several kids who are on Broadway now).  Not saying that there aren't problems but no production company trying to sell tickets to a kid friendly show is going to want the kids in the show to be abused.  .bad for business. 

https://labor.ny.gov/workerprotection/laborstandards/secure/child_index.shtm

10 minutes ago, fondoffouettes said:

 

• She complains about the sexualizing of dancers, and yet, she herself wrote an explicit, erotic memoir (though not while she was a dancer). I don't have issue with sexy ad campaigns (and I don't think NYCB's have been very sexualized) nor writing an erotic memoir. I just think it's somewhat hypocritical for her to take such a prudish stance in this piece.

Otherwise, I agree with much of what she says, especially about the board protecting Martins and his utter lack of interest in bringing in former dancers to coach ballets. 

Yep. . . and honestly, I found that memoir, to quote her "vulgar" and "amoral." 

Pot talking to kettle IMO. 

It has been picked up international press

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/sep/15/new-york-city-ballet-fires-two-dancers-for-sharing-nude-photos-of-women

Toni Bentley's weighing in? 

Can someone link the Op Ed? 

1 hour ago, Kathleen O'Connell said:

It may be that they received feedback from dancers and other NYCB employees after the Waterbury's complaint was made public that either advocated for dismissal or indicated that dismissal would be tolerated by the organization at large. 

Right, my point entirely. You can't make decisions about dismissal based on the level at which "the organization at large would tolerate them."  That's bizarre.  You should know your policies, know what's legally permissible and do what you are going to do.  That's my point, get PR OUT OF THE ROOM. You can't treat employment decisions like you would a season campaign, offensive photo on a website, or a press release.  

This could be a decision made by legal but waffling usually is not a good legal move and that's proving to be the case now. Just makes the organization seem unclear about it's own rules. 

Maybe I missed something but why are Ramasar and Catazaro, being fired after an initial decision was made for suspension? 

NYCB had 2 months with the evidence made available to them in June to determine if these two needed to be fired or not. They chose to suspend them but now, once the negative press is accelerating, they fire them?

Seems like a PR motivated thing to do. A panicked, "We've got to do something," move. 

What is new now that requires these two to be fired and not suspended as originally determined? 

NYCB needs to get their PR folks out of the decision making. The tale is wagging the dog. 

It seems that NYCB is making decisions based on some kind of a PR plan. 

Wow. . . just wow.  Moral courage is indeed rare.  

31 minutes ago, bcash said:

That quote at the end of NYT's article struck me as emotionally manipulative the very first time I read it. Using the imagery of innocent, eager, young female ballet students to blur the specifics of her case. Who did she expect to "protect" her, given that her relationship with Finlay started after she left SAB and that she was never associated with NYCB? And what Finlay was alleged to have done he didn't broadcast it for his company to know. How can she extrapolate from her sense of not being "protected" to the absence of "protection" for actual students of SAB, and by logic of her general reference, all the other ballet schools?

I  have no problem with Waterbury's quote, at all.  

I don't think that she was emotionally  manipulative. 

I was referring to Pointe's magazines' requests for various people to respond. 

This is what Pointe Magazine asked:

But should aspiring ballet dancers really "run in the other direction"?

Were her alleged experiences isolated indences perpetuated by a tiny percentage of just one company—or are they indicative of major problems in today's ballet culture within and beyond NYCB's walls?

The responses kind of went all over the place, some people did not respond to the questions but to Alex Waterbury's posts. . and honestly, several of the women were not supportive at all. Then other responders just kind of knitted together a bunch of silly platitudes or distanced themselves.  Honestly, the responses were odd. Perhaps without facts, they don't want to commit to very much?  

The whole Pointe quote collection didn't really shed much light on things for me? 

7 hours ago, KayDenmark said:

 

 

On the other hand, I would not advise a young and (by her own account) highly vulnerable young person to try to take on an uncertain and difficult case against a large institution like the NYCB. It seems to me like the people who are advising her to do so (her lawyer, various people who are after the AD job) may be using Miss Waterbury to advance their own agendas.

Yes

Yep. . she's actually been candid about her eating disorder. 

A  month or so ago she annouced going "vegetarian" or "vegan"

Does she want to dance???? Does DANCE give her joy? Pleasure? fulfillment? 

I'm betting on a settlement with an NDA.  Likely what the attorney wants.  NYCB would want this to go away, especially as a new AD comes in. There are probably a lot of people who could be asked to give accounts under oath that NYCB would not want out there, even if they do prevail legally. Just more bad PR for them in the middle of the #metoo movement. 

11 hours ago, MarzipanShepherdess said:

In articles 57-61 of the complaint, it is indicated that the men (Ramasar is named) to whom Finlay’s revenge porn images were sent WERE aware this was being done without Waterbury’s consent, and that they also knew she would be distressed to learn such images existed and were being shared. It is also indicated these men sent images in return which were also acknowledged as being shared/captured without their subjects’ consent (Ramasar acknowledges the subjects would be “pissed”). At least one such image was taken non-consensually of a dancer at work, while changing. 

To me this goes far beyond “describing sexual wishes” and “image-sharing”, and indicates that Ramasar and co knew they were receiving and/or sharing revenge porn with Finlay. 

It’s also worth noting that all the victims are described as being lower in company rank than the perpetrators—it sounds like these men knew who the company would let them get away with abusing. 

Whether or not a legal complaint is truly founded is questionable. Clearly morally and ethically the behaviors are troublesome and they do degrade the NYCB brand. 

It all distracts from the mission of the organization substantially and it is sorted, crass, and classless.