SanderO

I am with Leonid on this... and his view is what is part of the marvel of ballet. It is rather a constrained albeit very difficult technically fabric. When there is too much athleticism or even "virtuoisty" it is like a bright thick thread standing out in a perfect weave.

What is fascinating is how artist find expression in rather controlled techique. They seem to do it in the most sublime and subtle way... to my uneducated eyes. And so whatever "overdancing" may be.. it is like over acting and it turns the performance from art to caricature.

It is truly amazing how dancers can carve out so much individuality and artistry within such a rather restrained set of rules in classical ballet... very much the way musicians can play the same notes and the piece will sound different.

Interesting discussion here. So let me ask a rather dumb question. Why do ballerinas have long hair? I always associated long hair kept in a tight bun as iconic of a ballerina. But until reading this thread about dancers who have short hair, I never thought about why is it that they all (almost) have long hair. Certainly if you DO have long hair, keeping it in a bun would make dancing "easier".

I assumed wearing it in bun was a way to make the head a uniform shape and allow the neck and head to be seen without hair interfering with the line. Whilst long hair has a very feminine even sensual look, a tight bun often is seen as matronly which is definitely the way I see young beautiful dancers.

When a dancer lets her hair down... as I recall in Romero and Juliet my impression was it was to make Juliet look more childlike and so the hair was used like a costume prop so to speak. Obviously hair style is very much a part of the look for each role... with the bun being the most common style... no?

Can someone speak to the tradition of long hair and tight buns on ballerinas? Where did it start? Why?

I notice some posters have seen Ms Bussell or even other dancers perform in one or two ballets / roles and have them pegged as a certain type of dancer or skill whatever. How does one make an evaluation upon seeing one or two performances? Are these reviewers able to see little and conclude much or are they projecting? Can we assume that they have already some "standard" of that performance/role in their mind fixed as the basis for comparison? Does one need more formal training in dance to be able to critique so sharply and or a long history of seeing lots of ballet performances. I do notice some former dancers who post reviews here see things that the uneducated viewer (me) does not (yet). So.. how much does one need to see to form an opinion about a dancer's skill / technique etc.? And wouldn't a dancer perform the same role differently with different companies?

Grissi,

Thanks for the invitation! Spain is a beautiful country... duly noted. I will be at the ABT for the Spring season on Tuesdays and probably/hopefully for some other performances if I can make that happen. See you there!

Further to the idea of "meet me at the ballet"... would it make sense... assuming there is the desire to meet... for BT ballatomanes to announce which performances they are seeing in advance, so that they might have a face to face with other BT members who might be attending the same performance, before, during intermission or at the conclusion of the performance?

I often wonder about online communities, such as BT where members freely converse about a performance online (after the performance of course), for example, but failed to do so at the actual event they attended. Maybe they do and I am wrong here...

Carbro, both of the images on the covers of the books you cite are not the types of photographs I am trying to describe.

Of course most ballet photography is taken of dancers in performance and like the pictures cited they are beautiful photos of ballet.

I am looking for something perhaps more abstract, less like a frame from a film of the ballet... like a close up of even part of a dancer for the entire picture... using dancers doing ballet as the subject for creative photography.

Marketing images tend to be like snap shots from ballet scenes..(I am looking at ABT's spring subscription mailing as an example of this) but it is possible to compose a photo as a powerful visual statement... on its own...but using ballet as the subject matter.

Of course photography can be used to document in a very literal way... and much of the ballet photos are photos of performances are like that... but another example... suppose a photographer did multiple exposures of a dancer in motion... could look like a blur of motion. The subject would have been a ballet dancer... but the images would / could be a very artistic non documentary looking photo. I know this type of work has been done by photographers... I am just wondering if any have mounted an exhibit of this type of work... exclusively.

I would imagine that exhibits which richard notes are mostly about documenting the work of a company in the case cited a dancer.

I am wondering if anyone has seen an exhibit of art quality photographs where the subject matter was ballet but the work was not done for documentation or marketing but simply as the subject for the photographs? Perhaps I am not making this clear. Let me give an anaology.

There are photographs of building which show the buildings in a documenting manner. And then you will see buildings or parts of them as graphic images in some photographers work...

Does this make any sense?

I am interested in seeing an exhibition of ballet photography in a gallery setting. Has anyone seen such a show? Would you relate your experience of such an exhibit?

If an exhibition were curated would it be something you would like to see?

When I read about how some people travel so far back and forth or are forced to stay in an expensive hotel in NYC for example I wonder if it is not possible for some of local to the performances to offer some lodging to a fellow balletomane and perhaps see the performance together?

I realize that this is like taking a perfect stranger into your home, but if there is some effort to develop some sort of relationship it might be a way to make a new friend or two... and make the experience so much the richer.

We live close to NYC.. just 25 minutes on the train so this may be a bit far, but it might make it possible for some to go to the ballet in nyc. It's a concept.

What I like about this board is that it has some very educated ballet people who in fact do write very well mixed in with people such as myself who are enthusiastic but uneducated... and poor writers to boot! BT is a kind of education for us (me for sure) and without people such as sz, michael, leonid and many others I would very much in the dark. Their commentaries... I mean the educated ones... are what makes me want to see more ballet... because each time I do.. I am getting more and more from the experience.

It is really very generous to share your collective wisdom.

I just read the NY Times review of the Nut and compared to Ballet Talk's SZ or Michael, it reads as very amateurish and absent any insight as to what the reviewer saw... aside from a little kid stumbling.

Why can't the Times get people who see well, know dance and write well as does SZ or michael, to do dance reviews? Perhaps this is yet another example of the dumbing down of America.

Reading the reviews is like day and night. Thank you SZ and Michael for the light!

I would like to echo Alexandra in her praise of Leonid. I could only wish to have seen what he has seen with his eyes and his wisdom and knowledge of ballet is a treasure. Thank you Leonid.

This is an interesting discussion for me as I have wondered who is the "ultimate" director of a ballet performance. Clearly the dancers have to work with the music as an instrument, but unlike a musical instrument they are a visual one which seems to "express" all the other instruments...the music... so they are different from the violins or the cellos. The dancers are much more literal.. especially in a "story" ballet than any instrumental part could ever be.

Since, as a ballet goer, and one who has no experience as a dancer, musician etc... I have always made the assumption that there was one person who, like the choreographer, who performed the over arching role of putting it all together and this person came from the "dance side" of the production, not the music side... as the conductor would. The staging was their vision and that might include the choreography, the costumes, lighting and how the music is to "sound". Would it only be tempo?

But of course, a ballet, like a piece of music must remain faithful to the historical precedent, at least somewhat... so the variations are subtle and nuanced and give a performance / staging its own personality and the opportunity for individuality and virtuosity. This creates a continuity back into the history of a piece... and is one of the compelling and wonderful aspects of ballet... the identity of the work through history as defined the dancers who performed the principal roles.

Opera, for example, must stay faithful to the libretto and the music, but the staging... sets, costumes etc. can vary tremendously... especially since the costs of elaborate productions are not possible for all companies. Still, I wonder what impact Zeffirelli, for example, has on how the music is performed in his productions of La Traviata?

I suspect to learn how all this works we need to hear from those who have worked IN ballet as opposed to those such as myself who only see the final product.

Gene Schiavoine has posted a new series of photos from the ABT Fall Season at the City Center. This is well worth a viewing. I find his images stunning not only for how well they capture the moment and the movement in ballet, but how beautiful they are as graphic compositions. This man knows how to see ballet and get it onto film!

Some (many) of his photos I simply cannot stop looking at... among them is the one of Vishneva and Malakhov which is on this home page and the one of Sarawanee Tanatanit in Glow Stop. I feel so deeply drawn into their beauty suspended in time. It's the dance, the dancers, the lighting, and of course the photographer's eye. Am I crazy or what?

This may be OT and mods please re direct this comment.

One line stood out for me in the review, and perhaps others might comment. The dancer said that she enters at the end of the ballet without having the benefit of an established relationship with the audience.

On the face, this makes perfect sense because her part is a new character which the audience has not seen until her entrance. And I understand that performance art, such as ballet are for an audience.. which shows its appreciation at the conclusion in curtain calls, bravos etc. But how does a dancer feel the audience and the "relationship" from a silent house who sits there absorbing the ballet? In the mind of the audience THEY may empathize or feel a relationship to a character... just as when we sit in the movie house and react to the characters on the screen. (They of course are off doing something else and completely unaware of the impact of their performance on the audience in their cinema).

The orchestra plays a different role in the dance... as they ARE providing lots to the dancers and there is a relationship... but the audience-dancer relationship seems more like what you have in the cinema with the exception that the audience can and often does react with applause after a particular piece.. such as a pas de deux.

I often wonder how the dancers "feel" about this. On the one hand they surely appreciate the response along the way in a piece, but on the other hand it may cut the flow of energy and turn a piece into a series of vignettes of punctuated virtuosity.

An orchestral piece with several movements / sections is rarely interrupted (in my experience) by the audience. This seems to be more common in opera and ballet.

This raises several issues for both the ballet audience and the performers. As an audience member do you feel that intermittent approval adds or detracts to the overall entire performance... does it inspire (add) or detract from the dancer's performance and concentration in their role?

For the former dancers and other performers on BT... what are your thoughts about audience reactions in the course of a performance?

I just purchased my tickets for the ABT Spring series and this includes two Mannon performances, One with Ferri (6/14) and one with Vishneva (6/12). I doubt my wife will want to go to ballet 2x in one week... but who knows??? Depending on which one she chooses I could have an extra ticket for one of the perfomances. Anyone interested please contact me. I suspect she will choose Ferri, but who knows...

Thinking of you....

Anyone have an idea about the casts for The Sleeping Beauty?

When I attend the ABT at the Met I imagine there are a handful of BT posters in the audience... just never could tell who they are. I would think that in NYC there would be a pretty decent concentration of BT people in at the ABT and the NYCB. I know I missed a few at the opening night ABT gala this Fall.

I have made my Spring purchases for ABT so perhaps I might have the pleasure of meeting some of these wonderful balletomanes in 2007. I am seeing Ferri dance Mannon which I expect will be sold out as she is retiring this year. That should be one for memory lane I suspect.

How do you meet BT posters? How do you recognize them... or have you arranged to meet them via email in advance? That in itself might be an interesting thread... no?

How about using BT to organize a ballet talk posters' travel "ensemble" for trips such as nysusan's excursion to Boston.. share the driving... That might be a rewarding journey in many ways!

Leigh I wasn't sure if you traveled for ballet first and having friends there is the icing on the cake or... travel to visit friends and the ballet is the taste that lingered longest?

Who actually has made a ballet centric excursion? I would like to read about it.

As much as I love ballet and opera these days (more and more and I get older)... I still feel I need to have MORE reasons to make a trip to Europe than a performance... and I have never thought to build a trip around a performance. But things do change in importance in our lives and I have traveled to Madrid to seeing the Prato, for example. I think I would like to visit some of the great European venues for ballet and opera in the coming years. I think I need to bone up on this and would appreciate comments and suggestions.

I am fortunate to live in NYC where there are many dance performances, resident companies and visiting ones, not to mention opera and other "high cultural" experiences which are all very accessible. I was thinking about travel and Ballet as I was on Air France this weekend and they had interesting film about Patrick Dupond and the Paris Opera.

How far do balletomanes (not professionals) travel to attend performances? When you make a long excursion... do you see a series of performances? Do you do this often or regularly? What inspired you to make such an effort and undergo the expense? Have any balletomanes moved closer to a location to be able to regularly attend dance? When you travel for "normal" vacation or even business do you look for and attend performances?

Would you like to (and plan to) attend a performance in any special venue... such as the Paris Opera (if you live in the States? Is anyone organizing travel to see performances or is this done only by individuals with their own motivation?

In speaking with people sitting next to me at the Met, perhaps half are from way out of town... beyond commuting range. What are some of your experiences with travel to see ballet?

Thanks to all those who posted in this thread. This was a most enlightening view... I don't think I will ever see any of those works again with out being informed by this discussion. I find it immensely interesting at how articulate dance people (balletomanes and dancers) are about this art form which is completely absent words.

I am not familiar with many ballet photographers, but I have seen the work of Gene Schiavone who works for ABT and has a website:

http://www.geneschiavone.com/

I find his work captures in a still frame much of the movement of ballet... his black and white images seem particluarly strong.. such as the one on the first page of the site of Diana Vishneva and Vladimir Malakhov.

ViolinConcerto,

Are dancers writing back to you? Do your correspondences continue on? Do they ask about YOU etc?

How many balletomanes have corresponded with a dancer? What have you written to them about.. aside perhaps the obvious praise of their dancing... ? Are the replies substantive or simply polite acknowledgments? Have your correspondences developed into considerable depth?... veered away from ballet? Or even resulted in something beyond correspondence? Do you think dancers like to correspond with the public or prefer more privacy? What was your experience? What would you like to say to a particular dancer if you could?