Solor

so is she the "grand prima" of the Mariinksy? Is she the "Prima Ballerina Asoluta"?

I would say she is regarded by the St Petersburg audience as the "grand prima", but with her extremely narrow repertoire, it's difficult to see her as an "assoluta" in the conventional sense.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

narrow repretiore?

The best info on the St. Petersburg notators is found in Roland John Wiley's "Dances from Russia: An Introduction to the Sergejev [sic] Collection," published in the Harvard Library Bulletin, January 1976.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Has this been published anywhere? How can one get a hold of this to read?

so is she the "grand prima" of the Mariinksy? Is she the "Prima Ballerina Asoluta"?

Unknown to some, I'm sure, the recording mentioned by Ms. Holmes is actually a bootleg. It is from the Chritopher Seminars site, and, like the rest of the discs on his site are already existing recordings or out-of-print CDs that have been copied and re-packaged.

The orchestras and conductors credited are not the people that participated in these recordings. I don't even think that these ensembles even exist! For example, the recording up for purchase on his web page of "La Bayadere" (one of 3 recordings available of "La Bayadere") that is said on his page to be out-of-print is really Bonynge's recording with the English Chamber Orchestra. It is the music revised by Lanchbery for Makarova's production. The real realease is in print and available on Amazon.com. Compare the tracks and you'll see what I mean. Here's the link -

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...nce&s=classical

The same thing goes with the recording offered on his site of "Paquita", this one being the one by Spassov with the Sofia National Orchestra.

The "Le Corsaire" recording spoken of by Ms. Holmes is actually of the Decca 2-CD out-of-print set, conducted by Richard Bonynge with the English Chamber Orchestra. That set contains the whole of Adam's score as performed in 1867 for the Paris revival (not the 1858 original), along with the 'Jardin Anime' additions of Delibes, (though the numbers of this set included on the original release Bonynge/Decca disc are only the Flower Waltz and the Adagio of Medora with the Corps de Ballet and their garlands). There are additions on this 'christopher seminars' CD, such as the music for the 'trio of the odalisques',whic was taken from the film of ABT's "Corsaire", and it has had the applause in the background taken out, professionaly I'm sure. Heres the link to the original release:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...nce&s=classical

The other recording is the Kirov Ballet's version. Again, the music is taken from the film and professionally edited (taking out of applause etc.).

http://www.christopherseminars.com/Version...corsairehtm.htm

I'm am not condemning the Christopher Seminars site. I think its great that good out-of-print ballet is made available.

Quote - Cygnet

"Scholl also got (I'd say) rather pointed quotes from Dudinskaya herself on the matter, ("SB A Legend In Progress"). Perhaps Igor should have done the same?"

Indeed Scholl did.....and if she did'nt attend the premiere because of being offended, then her comments that were quoted in the book make her sound like kind of a hipocrate.

She said and I quote -

"Of course, Vaganova recieved the roles in thier original form from the hands of Petipa himself. As she always did, Vaganova taught us the original version staged by Petipa, without any simplifications, adaptations, deviations, or changes....However at present, none of the ballerinas dance the original versions as they were taught by Vaganova. All the performaers adapt, change, simplify, or slow down the tempo of the variations."

THEN SHE SAYS -

"This is not right. What is even more dangerous is that teahcers permit these changes."

This quote came from a special issue of the Russian dance journal 'Balet' (formerly Sovetsky Balet)

Then she is quoted in Scholl's book saying things like how Sergeyev's revivals preserve the old works. She also says that one cannot tell what is Petipa and what is Segeyev. She also says that Sereyev made the male roles more prominent in the old Ballerina cenetered ballets (though this is incedental to the fact that ballerina technique was more evolved than danseur technique, right?)

Then she is quoted saying -

"In my own teaching I adhere to the same principles to which I adhered while performing on stage. My students dance exactly what was choreographed, the way I danced, the way that I was taught by Agrippina Vaganova, who learned the originals from Marius Petipa himself. This helps in the preservation of a continuous link between the generations....

THEN SHE SAYS

"Our academy does not have the right to change the choreography of the great masters. Above all, it must preserve to irreplaceable heritage of Marius Petipa."

Perhaps she meant that students should know the orignals, but that does not mean they must perform them. But then again, from the sound of this quote, she was talking about performing the orginal Petipa.

Cygnet - I tried to look up this article by Igor Stupnikov but with no luck. Could you post it for us if you have it?

Well isnt that just a little overly dramatic!

So Duinskaya didnt go to the premiere out of respect for her husband? Why was it viewed as a disrespect? That is so....well I best keep my opinions to mself, I might make someone mad.

Cygnet, where did you hear all this? I did not know Dudinskaya got so personal over it, geez its just a ballet!

Cygnet -

What does Uliana Lopatkina have to do with it?

a little to my post, I remeber reading in an interview that Assylmoratova was very upset and in tears after seeing the New/Old Bayadere premiere. Not sure where I read it though.

How can anyone not like the Vikharev reconstruction? The Sergeyev version is so drab! The prologue sets look like finger paintings, the vision sceneis nice, and the 3rd act set looks like a faded picture. When I saw the reconstruction is was a dream come true. I have always wnated the Mariinsky to bring SB to its original form. Seeing SB made me wonder why anyone ever changed anything in the first place. That production is an absolute dream, the sets, the costumes, a REAL imperial production worthy not only of the Mariinsky but its awesome dancers. And true to 'Imperial-ness', the reconstruction is luxuriant and stuffed with gorgeousness. After reading Tim Scholl's book on the reconstruction and the reaction to it, it seemed to me that people just didnt want any change, and didnt want to give up what they were used to.

There is only 1 thing I dont like about the New/Old Sleeping Beauty - the attitude derriere poses that Aurora does right before the turns around the stage at the end of her 1st act variation - they could have left that part out.

Why on earth is the Mariinksy touring with that god-awful Sergeyev production?!?!?!?

I did a very careful comparison of the 2 recordings of Victor Fedotov with the Kirov Orchestra (of what I thought (from a review of it online) was the 1898 performance score) and the recording of Anisimov with the Moscow Symphony (the complete score of Glazunov).

With the help of Roland John Wiley's book "Century of Russian Ballet (BRAVO MR WILEY! what a wonderful piece of work), and Doug's post of the 1898 Raymonda (very insightful, BRAVO TO YOU TOO!), I found that the Fedotov recording is not of the 1898 premiere at all. The Fedotov recording had many scenes omitted from Act I, for example the opening scenes in Act I with the Countess Sybill were missing. The scene following Raymonda reading the letter from Jean de Brienne with the Glazunov added Entrance of Abderakhman was in place though. The scene following the White Lady's vision of Abderakhamn was ommited, going straight into the final scene. The children's dance from act III, used in modern times as a variation for Jean de Brienne is completly omitted as well. All of the "Scenes de Ballet" interpooations are intact. (I'd rather have a few incedental scenes missing than not have the very rarely recorded Glazunov modifications done to the score at Petipa's request)

I came to the conclusion, though I have never seen it, that the recording of Fedotov is not of the premiere of 1898 but of the Sergeyev version (the date I am not sure of) used by the Kirov Today, just like his recording of Sleeping Beauty - which is of the Sergeyev version. Not sure though.

In the film of the Mariinksy's "Swan Lake" from 1990 with Makhalina and Zelensky, the pas de trois has the last variation missing from it. The pas de trois is danced by Zelensky, Veronika Ivanova, and Larissa Lezhnina. Lezhnina would have danced the last variation of the pas, but for some reason it is omitted. Anyone know why?

P.S. - whats with the ugly brown blanket with white flowers that pops up in every Mariinksy/Kirov staging?

I was just wondering if any others were available commercially. Its not all that bad, the Semenyaka film, but at times, its way too "Bolshoi" (something that the Bolshoi doesnt seem to do anymore). The dancers look better from far away, but when you get up close, you see just how sloppy the dancing is.

I have seen the Bessmertnova film, but I do not care much for the dancing of Bessmertnova, save "Spartacus", where not only her own style, but that seemingly extinct "too Bolshoi" style of about 10 years ago or so fits that ballet like a glove.

I was reading an interview with Larissa Lezhnina. In the inter view she said quote -

"But then again, he did so many bad things — like firing talented ballerinas such as Mezentseva, Kunakova. I mean, Mezentseva — she was almost like a legend in the Kirov."

She was speaking about Oleg Vinogradov. I didnt know he did this. It got me to thinking though, why did he do it? And when did he do it? What other bad stuff did he do for the Kirov, or to other dancers, or what other good stuff? Where is he now? Any info would be cool.

I have the Bolshoi's "Raymonda", but arent there any other versions on film besides the Paris Opera's documetary version? The Bolshoi's production is BLAH (though Gedaminas Taranda is a great Abderakhman), and lacks any detail that I'm sure exsisted in the original Petipa. Nureyev's version is cool, but the Paris Opera's DVD is a documentary / performance.

Does the Kirov have a film? I doubt it..............

It doesn't mention on the CD what score was used but as a reviewer noted, "this recording contains The Black Swan Pas de deux which was not part of the original score for Swan Lake and is often not included in many recordings."

It doesn't seem they used much other Drigo?  It's a great recording maybe it's the best there is I don't know.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That recording is indeed the orignal score from 1877 - the reviewer seems to share in the confusion that many perople have concerning the original 1st act PDD that was later revised to become the Grand Pas for act 3 (or in the case of the Kirov act II). The pdd recorded in this case is the orignal Tchaikvosy,and not the one later revised by Drigo and company.

In my own educated opinion as a ballet dancer and collector of 19th century ballet music on CD, the best recording of the original score is by Charles Dutoit conducting the Montreal Symphony (this recording ommits a number in act II, the Swan's Waltz reprise, but does contain a great recording if the "Tchikovsky Pas de Deux"). It is well conducted without the usual rushed tempi of most symphonic conductors. The conductor Dutoit, wether he was aware of it or not, conducts the classical variations well, with a "dancer aware" tempo and ending of each varaition, slowing down the music a little at the end. Heres the link -

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...nce&s=classical

The next is of course the Fedotov recording of the Drigo revised score of 1895, though at times Fedotov seems to forget his ballet conducting and rushes things a little. Heres the link to that one -

http://www.classicalrecords.ru/cr/cd-en/042.htm

The next is a recording if excerpts by the Georgian Festival Orchestra conducted by Vato Kahl. This recording conatins properly conducted numbers with thier 1895 revisions, such as the "White Adagio" from the 2nd act, the pas de trois (only the 1st variation is recorded here, along with the coda), the entree, adagio, and solo for Siegfried from the 'Black Swan' Pas, the Swans Waltz, the opening scene in Act II with all the editions of 1895 and a wonderfully performed "entrance fo Odette". Heres that link - sample the music!

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...g=UTF8&v=glance

The next recording I would recomend is a recording by Boris Spassov conducting the Sofia National Opera Orch. called "Pas de Deux". This disc contains many treasures of the ballet, but it has the best recording I have ever heard of the 'Black Swan' pas de deux. The variations, adagio, and entree are all played at the proper tempo. A great thing to have if one ever needs a recording of this number. It also conatins the pas de deux from "Le Corsaire", "Flower Festival at Genzano", "The Flames of Paris", the grand pas and the 'peasant pas de deux' from "Giselle", and the very very very old pas de deux from Hertel's score of "Le Fille Mal Gardee". This item was only available in Europe but is now available in the states. Heres the link -

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00...7142393-1020743

Estelle - The performance on the DVD of the POB's "Paquita" was Jauary 2003.

I mostly got this DVD because I am really into reconstructions, especially those that were made by, (or made to last by) Petipa. I wish that more of them were around......I hope that the "powers that be" (as far as resurrecting these great works from the dead goes) re-create some of the REALLY big Grand Ballets of Petipa's time: such as "La Esmeralda", "Le Corsaire" (Petipa's final revivals of course!), "The Stars", "Le Talisman", even "Don Quixote"! - nothing beats a 19th century ballet with a shmoltzy ballet score by the likes of Pugni, Minkus or Drigo (Drigo being the better of the three however)!

I was sampeling recordings of "Les Sylphides" on Amazon.com. I came across one that had the ballet in the arrangement of Glazunov (who had originally orchestrated the Chopin music for the 1909 premiere) and I found tunes I had never heard before. This music is available with a recording of "The Nutcracker". Heres the link to it -

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...=samples#disc_1

what is this music? I have never a seen a "Les Sylphides" with this music included.

I just learned that petipa did another ballet with Glazunov called "Lady Soubrette" (AKA "Ruses d'Amour")

What is the history of this ballet "Lady Soubrette" / "Ruses d' Amoure" by Glazunov? I did not know that Petipa did another ballet with Glazunov besides "Raymonda".

Yea MinkusPugni, I put this up a while ago. Though it is not ALL of them (the score had little alterations done here and there) but heres the list of the most obvious:

Drigo only did a few things to the score as far as BIG changes are concerned (I mean additions of music and/or revisions of endings to certain numbers). Aside from editing and, for example, changing a number from, say, 'allegro vivance' to 'moderato' (the first variation in the 1st act pas de trois) he did the following (and keep in mind, all at the behest of Ivanov and Petipa):

**the Waltz and the pas de trois in Act I were reversed.

**the order of the Dances of the Swans was changed from -

swans waltz, odettes variation, the little swans, the big swans, pas d'action (or white adagio), swans waltz reprise (cut in 1895), and the coda. The new order, following the formula of a grand pas d'action, went as so - swans waltz, "white" adagio, the little swans, the big swans, odettes variation, coda.

**he revised the ending of the 'white' adagio in the 2nd act from the original allegro ending, and gave it the more familiar close we know of today. Also, he extended the harp arpeggios that were originally composed.

**he revised the coda and extended it by having it repeat before the end.

**the entrance of Odille was now followed by the grand Divertessment. The Spanish Dance came to next so that the music could transition smoothly.

**he transfered the pas de deux from the 1st act to the 3rd (after the grand divertessment), making it the famous "Black Swan" pas de deux (Originally, Odille was just a "Magic Swan", not a black one - this came in later revivals). He revised the ending from the original allegro to a new closing (as with the 2nd act adagio). The familiar variation for Siegfried was fashioned out of the omitted allegro. This did not happen for the 1st production. It was inserted into the pas by Vakhtang Chabukiani in 1941 I think.

**Drigo then fashioned a variation for Odille to a piece from Tchaikovsky's opus 72 for piano - "L'espiegle op.72/no.12".........orchestrated very well I might add! Very colorful and rich arrangements - especially when heard live or on CD. Then came the familiar coda (where the famous 32 foutees were performed) this was left pretty much unchanged except for an internal repeat being deleted.

**For the last act, the opening number was edited. This number originally went into the "Dance of the Little Swans", which was ommitted for the next number. The original Harp candenza was extended to go into the next addition of Drigo etc. -

**Drigo's next interpolation came again from Tchaikovsky's opus 72 for piano - in this case it was "Valse Bluette op.72/no.11". This was added as a waltz for the Swans, and replaced the number originally composed. Drigo's orchestrations for this piece are magical and brilliant - a joy to hear live or on CD.

**and the last insertion was for a short pas d'action for the two lovers, again from opus 72 - "Un Poco di Chopin op.72/no.15". Of all of the additions, this is the one I always felt could have been done without, not that it is not a well arranged number - again, Drigo does a fine job orchestrating.

As far as the "Tchainovsy Pas de Deux" goes (It should really be called the "Minkus orchestrated by Tchainovsky Pas de Deux"): A ballerina named Anna Sobeshanskaya who did not like the choreographer of the first 1877 production of "Swan Lake" nor did she care much for Tchaikovskys score. So, she travled from Moscow to St. Petersburg so that the choreographer Petipa could fashion a new pas de deux for her to the music of Minkus. When Tchaikovsky heard of this he objected to the interpolation of another composers music. So he agreed to compose a new pas for Sobeshanskaya. But it left the problem of the choreography having to be changed, and Sobeshanskaya did not want to go to Petipa a second time. It is said Tchaikovsky composed a pas that would bar for bar and note for note match the music of Minkus. It is said that the male variation of this pas was left un-touched by Tchaikovsky, and it carries the signature sound of a 19th century 3/4 male variation (main melody, central melody, back to main melody). If one listens to it, it certainly appears so. I have read in a few places that the "Tchaikovsky pas de deux" is actually Minkus's music with Tchaikovsky's orchestrations. It really does sound like this is true, to me anyway.....

----special thanks to Roland Wiley's "Tchaikovsky's Ballets" for helping me with this list! And Victor Fedotov's recording of "Swan Lake" with the Orchestra of the Mariinksy Theatre.

MinkusPugni - You should really get "Tchaikovsky's Ballets" by Roland John Wiley. It is out of print but you can get a used copy through Amazon.com. It is probably gonna be pretty pricey though. Also, there is a re-issue of the "Swan Lake" recording by the late ballet conductor for the Kirov Victor Fedotov of the complete performance score modified by Drigo. It is available through this page -

http://www.classicalrecords.ru/cr/cd-en/042.htm

It is kind of a pain in the you know what to get a hold of (I has to do an international bank transfer to buy it).....but you can get it! Also, they have a re-issue of the performance score of the Petipa's 1898 "Raymonda".

The danseuse in the role of Paquita is Agnes Letestu. Tha dancers in the pas de trois are not credited.

I do beleive that a dancer can be strong at the barre and weak in the center, and these ballerinas had that look to their dancing.

I just bought the POB's "Paquita": Lacotte's reconstruction. Of all the ballets that Lacotte could have restored, its beyond me why he chose this one. Why not "La Esmerelda"? Why not "Le Corsaire"? The sets were really drab and the costumes were nothing special. The Grand Pas had only two variations. Lacotte ommitted the traditional variation for Paquita (composed by Drigo I think), along with the variations for the ballerina soloists.

I was shocked by the style and technique of the ballerinas in this performance. The two ladies that danced the famous Pas de Trois really suprised me. Thier dancing was so 'plain jane' and techniacally un-remarkable for a professional, world class company such as the Paris Opera Ballet. The leading danseuse in the role of "Paquita" was another suprise, with a poor performance that had absolutly no style and awful technique - I mean she was really bad - I have had students in the intermediate level that were better than this lady - and she holds the rank of Etoile! I was shocked that such dancers were actually put on the stage of the Grand Opera! On the other hand the male dancers were all good and well trained, though they aint' from ABT or the Mariinksy......

So what gives? For those who have viewed this film as well, do you see what I'm talking about? Why are the ballerinas of the Paris Opera Ballet looking like this these days?

Pardon my spelling, hopefully you know who Im talking about......

For those who participated in the disscussion of Veronika Ivanova, what about Irina Chistyakova (Last Name spelling?) I have seen her as well in many films (For those who dont know, she dances the waltz variation in the Trio of Odalisques in the Kirov film of "Le Corsaire"). I dont see her on the Kirov list of dancers though (she may have retired). Whats with her? I love her in many of the variations I have of her on film - she can do 3 pirrouettes and end the variation in susu 5th, and not budge......."queen of variations"! Wonderful, solid technique. Very "VAGANOVA"!

Like Ivanova, she is the kind of dancer, I think, that never made premiere either - whats up with her these days???

I was wondering......I have many films of the Kirov dancing. These films, many of them from the 80s, have lots of great dancers in them, some of them still in the company. But when I visited the Kirov web page, I noticed that a few of these dancers, like Veronika Ivanova, are but mere soloists after being in the company for so long and being such great dancers! I have seen her in films and books from the 80s to know and she isnt of premiere rank? What is the deal?

Well....I wonder why she left the Kirov? And where she went after? And where she is now. Searching around online is of no help.

No Mohnurka......thats Veronika Ivanova in the pas de trois from Swan Lake with Lezhnina. .....speaking of which, I have a few questions about her......

What is she up to these days?

Does the Mariinsky still perfom "Fille Mal Fardee"?

I have a book called "A Century of Russian Ballet" by Jeremy Noble. It is a Desk Diary, with each week of the year highlighting a different dancer fom Preobrajenska on up (starting with Petipa). On page 89 (for those with the book) there is a little picture in the upper left corner of a scene from the Mariinksy's production of "La Fille Mal Gardee" from 1989. I dont know which scene this picture is from, but the set is absolutly beautiful.

On thier web site, the Mariinsky does not have this ballet listed in their repretoire, and I have never heard of them performing it, except for a LONG time ago.

Do they still perfom it? If so, how much of it is of Petipa, or the version from the old days of the Imperial Ballet?