"The great malaise of the Paris Opera Ballet" !!

[Vs1]

4 hours ago, Buddy said:

I don’t really understand what this means, Vs1, after partially quoting my post. Maybe you could elaborate. Thanks.

When I wrote that Aurélie Dupont “seemed to like (?) Myriam Ould-Braham, whom I consider to be one of the most underused jewels of the ballet world” her liking was only based on my very sketchy feelings, nothing more and not intended to be a statement of certainty. Aurélie Dupont was listed as the ‘coach’ for a La Bayadere that featured Myriam Ould-Braham. Whether she had special involvement with her I don’t know, but she was at least overseeing what turned out to be a wonderful performance by Myriam Ould-Braham, in my opinion. Also last December Myriam Ould-Braham was given three or four appearances in the long Swan Lake series, but so, admittedly, were a couple other ballerinas. But this was the most that I’d ever seen Myriam Ould-Braham given. I’ll add that I would have gladly taken the six hour train ride to Paris to see her, as I did for her La Bayadere, but tickets at a reasonable price were not available, at least from the POB site.      

 

Aurelie complained in the same way as m about the school.

[Buddy]

36 minutes ago, Vs1 said:

Aurelie complained in the same way as m about the school.

Thanks, Vs1. I assume "m" is Myriam Ould-Braham. I'll add since I'm thinking about it that tickets for the 'classics' seem to sell out immediately.

Edited April 19 by Buddy

[naomikage]

Aurelie Dupont's farewell performance series were the first time she danced with Roberto Bolle.  They have not danced together in galas. (She has confirmed this in an interview) 

[pherank]

37 minutes ago, naomikage said:

Aurelie Dupont's farewell performance series were the first time she danced with Roberto Bolle.  They have not danced together in galas. (She has confirmed this in an interview) 

I'd be willing to bet that management asked her what she wanted to do for her farewell performance, and she said, "to dance with Roberto Bolle whom I've always admired". And she got to do just that. It was not likely intended to have any more meaning than that. Of course there are always going to be people who read too much into things.  ;)
I really doubt it was meant to be a slight to the current dancers or former partners like Manuel Legris. Should she have thought it through more? Possibly, but that was her pick. If it was obvious that she meant to slight her compatriots it would be very unlikely that Lissner would have hired her as A.D. Why hire someone who is feuding with her colleagues? I doubt he's that stupid.

[volcanohunter]

Apparently when Dupont and the company were discussing her final performance she decided on dancing Manon with Hervé Moreau. But when he became unavailable, the management would have said, unfortunately Moreau is injured, but Mathieu Ganio, Josua Hoffalt and Florian Magnenet are available, and at that point she expressed a desire to dance with Robert Bolle, on national television. How could Ganio and Hoffalt not take that as a slight? She may have been within her rights to choose an outside partner, but that decision could not benefit company morale. She probably wasn't thinking about "the team" when she made her choice, but it was bound to come back and haunt her when she was put in charge of that same team.

[silvermash]

4 hours ago, pherank said:

I'd be willing to bet that management asked her what she wanted to do for her farewell performance, and she said, "to dance with Roberto Bolle whom I've always admired". And she got to do just that. It was not likely intended to have any more meaning than that. Of course there are always going to be people who read too much into things.  ;)
I really doubt it was meant to be a slight to the current dancers or former partners like Manuel Legris. Should she have thought it through more? Possibly, but that was her pick. If it was obvious that she meant to slight her compatriots it would be very unlikely that Lissner would have hired her as A.D. Why hire someone who is feuding with her colleagues? I doubt he's that stupid.

Although she had said when she was asked about it at first (that is when Hervé Moreau was supposedly already retired) that she would dance with Josua Hoffalt, I don't think that in the case of her retirement show, it was a surprise, that Madame Dupont asked for Roberto Bolle because as I said before, she was known to choose her partners and to avoid series when she could not. By then, as a dancer, she didn't care about the effects it could have inside the company, and for the audience. And although she now may be paying the price, I don’t think she cares either.

The best question is what Lissner has in his agenda? In choosing Millepied then Dupont?

[pherank]

And for all we know, Dupont and Lissner (and other interviewers) had a talk about such 'situations' arising, and how to avoid them. Of course, if POB senior staff hired Dupont and Millepied simply based on their youthful enthusiasm, and didn't spend any time talking about what the job entails and the kind of pitfalls that exist, then they are likely a very unprofessional management team, from the top down. And that's a much bigger problem than a dancer's faux pas at her farewell. It is easy to use the A.D. as a scapegoat since they are so publicly visible in a large ballet company. But there are always other powers at work behind the A.D. who help maintain the culture. Did Martins' retirement really cure what ails NYCB company culture? The bigger problem there may be that bad behavior was so often tolerated or simply ignored. At POB, the problem may be that they worry too much about whether the A.D. appears exciting and sexy, and staff should be worrying about whether the candidate is truly competent in running a large company of artists. It's style over substance.

Edited April 20 by pherank

[Drew]

2 hours ago, volcanohunter said:

Apparently when Dupont and the company were discussing her final performance she decided on dancing Manon with Hervé Moreau. But when he became unavailable, the management would have said, unfortunately Moreau is injured, but Mathieu Ganio, Josua Hoffalt and Florian Magnenet are available, and at that point she expressed a desire to dance with Robert Bolle, on national television. How could Ganio and Hoffalt not take that as a slight? She may have been within her rights to choose an outside partner, but that decision could not benefit company morale. She probably wasn't thinking about "the team" when she made her choice, but it was bound to come back and haunt her when she was put in charge of that same team.

Do you then believe that multiple principal dancers are still steaming about her final performance? I mean it as a real question not a rhetorical one...but I admit that while I can picture that they would still look back with irritation to her choice and must have felt slighted at the time....the idea that they would be so resentful as to let it poison their relations with her several years later and now that she is Director of the company or generally let it poison her directorship seems unexpected to me--unless they're twelve. That is, I can't help but think that would speak to problems that aren't really on Dupont but on their maturity and professionalism and general willingness to move forward under new leadership.

Edited April 20 by Drew

[silvermash]

It was her choice, it just gives an insight about who she is and how she can think...

[Laurent]

No need to look for causes where there are none. The problems with Dupont leading the company have nothing to do with whoever she chose to be her partner in her retirement performance. The ones who know the company well also know that partnering aging Dupont was not something the leading male soloists were particularly vying for, François Alu's current problems are due to the fact that he committed a gaffe to say it loud.

The problem number one is not even Dupont's management skills but her lack of great passion for ballet. This is what she has been mentioning herself, and not once, this is the essence of what Claude Bessy meant when she was responding to Dupont's complaining to the press about her "sufferings" at the School, this is what Parisian ballet lovers where seeing on stage for two decades: great physique, great schooling, and no true love for ballet. Lissner's blunder is that he doesn't understand (or care) that a successful leader of the ballet troupe must be somebody who loves ballet, and loves passionately. All the rest is secondary in importance.

[Helene]

Revenge is a dish best served cold.

[Vs1]

Seems very petty if that's the reason 

 

if she denies dancing with does she deny dancing at his galas

[Jayne]

On 4/19/2018 at 11:53 PM, pherank said:

Did Martins' retirement really cure what ails NYCB company culture? The bigger problem there may be that bad behavior was so often tolerated or simply ignored.

I cannot recall criticisms of NYCB outside of Peter Martins’ behavior and management choices.  Can you enlighten us?  

A company as large as POB really needs a larger management team.  I lament that Madame Dupont did not hire an Associate AD with more management experience to help light the way forward.  

[silvermash]

2 hours ago, Jayne said:

I cannot recall criticisms of NYCB outside of Peter Martins’ behavior and management choices.  Can you enlighten us?  

A company as large as POB really needs a larger management team.  I lament that Madame Dupont did not hire an Associate AD with more management experience to help light the way forward.  

Well there is a management team. An artistic team with a chief ballet master, associate director (and a couple of ballet master) and a dance administrator.

[naomikage]

19 hours ago, Vs1 said:

Seems very petty if that's the reason 

 

if she denies dancing with does she deny dancing at his galas

I have to confirm you that on Shinshokan Dance Magazine August 2015 issue, she said that the Manon farewell series was her first time dancing with Roberto Bolle. (but also she says she looks forward for more opportunities dancing with him) and also previously she has said she wanted to dance with someone new and secure once Herve Moreau became unavailable so she thought dancing with Bolle would be a nice idea. 

And Dupont is announced to dance in the World Ballet Festival this summer in Tokyo. (although it is not announced who she will be dancing, Bolle is also announced to be in this gala)

Do you have any proof that she had danced with him before? I could not find any by googling.

[Vs1]

Just now, naomikage said:

I have to confirm you that on Shinshokan Dance Magazine August 2015 issue, she said that the Manon farewell series was her first time dancing with Roberto Bolle. (but also she says she looks forward for more opportunities dancing with him) and also previously she has said she wanted to dance with someone new and secure once Herve Moreau became unavailable so she thought dancing with Bolle would be a nice idea. 

And Dupont is announced to dance in the World Ballet Festival this summer in Tokyo. (although it is not announced who she will be dancing, Bolle is also announced to be in this gala)

Do you have any proof that she had danced with him before? I could not find any by googling.

So she  is dancing post-retirement?  She was on his site, and his fans' sites, but how would anyone know the veracity of what anyone says or what it means?  (E.g., did he dance with her or did she dance with someone else at his gala? Was the magazine or she truthful or accurate? Is that tolerable or not (see below re Martins).  He had a video on the New York Mag site for a long time about Ferri that is no longer there, either.  So I have no idea what is or is not on Google

Edited April 21 by Vs1

[Vs1]

Just now, Jayne said:

I cannot recall criticisms of NYCB outside of Peter Martins’ behavior and management choices.  The bigger problem there may be that bad behavior was so often tolerated or simply ignored.

Well, what is the cure? Intolerance of the things that are tolerable to some but not others? No criticism?  The immigration rules (which did not help solve a problem), as discussed elsewhere?

Edited April 21 by Vs1

[naomikage]

Aurelie Dupont has been dancing quite a lot since her retirement at the Opera and even after she has been appointed AD.

She has guested in Martha Graham Company just after her retirement. (and we can see the company is invited to guest at POB next season) Also Ohad Naharin created a piece for her and Diana Vishneva for Vishneva's festival Context. 

Also, she had danced in POB's Japan tour last March (after her appointment) , Daphnis and Chloe. At first it was supposed to be with Herve Moreau but as he was unavailable, she danced with Germain Louvet. She also guested in Tokyo Ballet's Bejart Bolero performance.  and also danced at the Lincoln Center Festival's Saburo Teshigawara performance last summer. 

Retiring POB does not mean retiring as a dancer so it is not fair to criticize her that she is dancing quite a lot, many ADs do dance,  but she ought to do her job as AD first. 

[Vs1]

Just now, naomikage said:

Aurelie Dupont has been dancing quite a lot since her retirement at the Opera and even after she has been appointed AD.

She has guested in Martha Graham Company just after her retirement. (and we can see the company is invited to guest at POB next season) Also Ohad Naharin created a piece for her and Diana Vishneva for Vishneva's festival Context. 

Also, she had danced in POB's Japan tour last March (after her appointment) , Daphnis and Chloe. At first it was supposed to be with Herve Moreau but as he was unavailable, she danced with Germain Louvet. She also guested in Tokyo Ballet's Bejart Bolero performance.  and also danced at the Lincoln Center Festival's Saburo Teshigawara performance last summer. 

Retiring POB does not mean retiring as a dancer so it is not fair to criticize her that she is dancing quite a lot, many ADs do dance,  but she ought to do her job as AD first. 

I didn't criticize her.  I do remember the Graham ad but forgot to see it at the time. 

Which Daphnis did she dance?

I missed LCF but passed by some stands with Kabuki type information. Did she dance Kabuki or a modern dance?

Why do people say she lacks passion for classical ballet? Absent that, how would she have endured her schooling and career, and "after career", considering its demands and her misery. 

[pherank]

14 hours ago, Jayne said:

I cannot recall criticisms of NYCB outside of Peter Martins’ behavior and management choices.  Can you enlighten us?  

A company as large as POB really needs a larger management team.  I lament that Madame Dupont did not hire an Associate AD with more management experience to help light the way forward.  

 

12 hours ago, silvermash said:

Well there is a management team. An artistic team with a chief ballet master, associate director (and a couple of ballet master) and a dance administrator.

[There are something like 12 ballet masters at NYCB. The number of staff people in general is quite large.]

I was thinking of both the management staff at NYCB - the people "inside the building", as well as the Board of Directors.
The question has been: how many of these people are complicit in what essentially is a cover-up of bad behavior over many years?

The notion that Martins was the only person at NYCB who ever demonstrated emotionally or physically abusive behavior is incredibly unlikely. Or NYCB really is a magic kingdom. It's going to be the same situation at POB - there will be various incidents involving different people. Ideally, both the 'victims' and the 'accused' should receive immediate counseling (if it isn't also a legal matter). But the school and the company probably need a clearer set of rules for behavior at POB. And POB members need a clear process for dealing with "abusive" situations that arise.

[alexL]

2 hours ago, Vs1 said:

Which Daphnis did she dance?

I missed LCF but passed by some stands with Kabuki type information. Did she dance Kabuki or a modern dance?

It was Benjamin Millepied's. 

Kabuki? Really? It was a modern dance piece that has nothing to do with the traditional kabuki art form. Saburo Teshigawara is a very respected modern choreographer who's been active since 80's. If anything, he had studied ballet before becoming a choreographer so ballet has greater influence in his work than kabuki. 

[volcanohunter]

3 hours ago, Vs1 said:

Why do people say she lacks passion for classical ballet? Absent that, how would she have endured her schooling and career, and "after career", considering its demands and her misery. 

Because she was good at it. But having an aptitude for something doesn't mean a person enjoys doing it.

To give you a more prosaic example: me in grad school. Straight As, one scholarship after another and total misery. In fact, I always did so well in school that it never occurred to anyone, including myself, that I flat-out, absolutely detested every minute of it.

[Vs1]

Just now, volcanohunter said:

Because she was good at it. But having an aptitude for something doesn't mean a person enjoys doing it.

To give you a more prosaic example: me in grad school. Straight As, one scholarship after another and total misery. In fact, I always did so well in school that it never occurred to anyone, including myself, that I flat-out, absolutely detested every minute of it.

Yes, but would you not have discontinued it at some point? E.g., the Sasha Radetsky movie and the best in class ballerina student with the ballet mom (I think). 

Maybe you liked and hated school? I am sure it was boring as hell for you, which was a part you probably hated (forgive my speculation). Maybe no one did anything to relieve your boredom. But you had to go to school. She didn't have to go to ballet school, be a ballerina, or become an AD.

 

Just now, alexL said:

It was Benjamin Millepied's. 

Kabuki? Really? It was a modern dance piece that has nothing to do with the traditional kabuki art form. Saburo Teshigawara is a very respected modern choreographer who's been active since 80's. If anything, he had studied ballet before becoming a choreographer so ballet has greater influence in his work than kabuki. 

Sorry for not looking that up. 

[Vs1]

Just now, pherank said:

 

[There are something like 12 ballet masters at NYCB. The number of staff people in general is quite large.]

I was thinking of both the management staff at NYCB - the people "inside the building", as well as the Board of Directors.
The question has been: how many of these people are complicit in what essentially is a cover-up of bad behavior over many years?

The notion that Martins was the only person at NYCB who ever demonstrated emotionally or physically abusive behavior is incredibly unlikely. Or NYCB really is a magic kingdom. It's going to be the same situation at POB - there will be various incidents involving different people. Ideally, both the 'victims' and the 'accused' should receive immediate counseling (if it isn't also a legal matter). But the school and the company probably need a clearer set of rules for behavior at POB. And POB members need a clear process for dealing with "abusive" situations that arise.

What kind of counseling? Training in how to behave when in power? Good luck.   Heel? Be nice?

Talking to a dr?  Depends on the type of harassment and your belief in the dsm or pharmacology.

[nanushka]

11 minutes ago, Vs1 said:

But you had to go to school. She didn't have to go to ballet school, be a ballerina, or become an AD.

Isn't it possibly quite similar? Grad school can feel like a calling and a commitment, even if one in fact hates it — especially if one has innate talent. The same, I imagine, could be true of being a dancer.

Edited April 21 by nanushka
word choice