nanushka Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 57 minutes ago, canbelto said: What she said about Hyltin was graceless. I do wish we had a direct quote — but yes, it almost certainly was. So far as I can see, this is the only part where Bouder is cited as having directly commented on Hyltin: Quote Ms. Bouder said she believed that Mr. Martins made the casting change to retaliate for her outspokenness about feminism and gender equality and to reward Ms. Hyltin, who had publicly defended him. That said, if indeed Martins acted in retaliation for her previous public comments, and if one believes some of more troubling allegations that have been made against him (not at all a given, I know), the hashtags on Bouder's Instagram post today carry some force: #timesup #speakout #nomoresilence #standup #nomoreretaliation #speakoutforchange #thisisnotok Edited February 22, 2019 by nanushka Link to comment
FPF Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 2 hours ago, vipa said: I'll go ahead and say that the article bothered me. Who knows who at the NYTimes, such that while the art of ballet gets little coverage, we get an article about "unfair" casting of Sleeping Beauty, that brings up yet again accusations against Martins, Ramasar etc. The NYT coverage of dance has really declined in the past couple of years. I wrote to the Arts editor last year when they had a puff piece about Mearns making her debut as Carabosse, but they never reviewed her performance in the role (and still haven't). Link to comment
balletforme Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 2 hours ago, abatt said: Stafford should have given a simple "no comment" to the NY Times. Why do you think Stafford, who is usually quite low key, chose not to give "no comment?" Link to comment
FPF Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 2 hours ago, dirac said: My takeaway is that Board needs to make its long-overdue decision about the leadership pronto. I agree--I can understand why a new AD may not have been able to take over just yet. But not why none has been named. Link to comment
JuliaJ Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 5 minutes ago, FPF said: The NYT coverage of dance has really declined in the past couple of years. I wrote to the Arts editor last year when they had a puff piece about Mearns making her debut as Carabosse, but they never reviewed her performance in the role (and still haven't). Ever since the Martins resignation the NYT arts section seems really set on making the company (and ballet as an art form) look bad. They must be super proud of such "investigative" journalism in an area where performance reviews are supposed to be the norm. I enjoy the reviews the rare times they're published, and even the puff pieces, but almost every article seems to have some kind of moralistic, social-justice-related agenda. Who knows how much the writer of the article cherry-picked quotes from her interviews with Bouder and Stafford to achieve maximum Martins-smearing. I actually prefer reading Alastair Macauley's more informal musings on Instagram. Link to comment
abatt Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 25 minutes ago, balletforme said: Why do you think Stafford, who is usually quite low key, chose not to give "no comment?" The Board of Directors is now hearing about Martins' alleged retaliation and his going backstage, all courtesy of the NYTimes. This is the same Board that is now deciding if Stafford will run the company permanently. I guess he was sending a direct message out to the public and the Board that he attempted to control the situation, but Martins did not comply. Stafford is being defensive regarding why he apparently had no control over the situation. Ironically, Martins has been the impetus for Stafford's administrative rise within the company. It was Martins who invited him to teach and take on numerous admin. duties while Martins still ran the company. Edited February 22, 2019 by abatt Link to comment
abatt Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 3 minutes ago, JuliaJ said: Ever since the Martins resignation the NYT arts section seems really set on making the company (and ballet as an art form) look bad. They must be super proud of such "investigative" journalism in an area where performance reviews are supposed to be the norm. I I question whether the Times initially "investigated" or alternatively whether Bouder contacted the NYTimes. Link to comment
Lcg Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 Ms Bouders partner in her Instagram photo looks much like Damien Woetzel who retired ten years ago. Would someone on this Board please enlighten me as to the correct identity? In any case, even one who may have excelled in a role several years ago sometimes “outgrows” it. A somewhat polite way of saying that they just do not look as good as they once did. In the case of SB that means being somewhat able to convince the audience that she is sixteen.Techicnical proficiency is not everything, especially in a story ballet. Link to comment
FPF Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 Yes, that is Damian Woetzel .It says in the article that she debuted as Aurora at twenty with Damian as her partner. Link to comment
Rock Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 Yup - that's Damien Woetzel in that photograph. And young. She's making a point of how long she's done Aurora. She's certainly not "old" now and has lost none of her technique, one just questions the wisdom of saying that about Sterling Hyltin. Neither nice nor attractive. If Indiana Woodward was anywhere near as good as posters here say it's a shame that there's no review of her performance and instead this snarky backstage article. The distance from the Post to the Times narrows... Link to comment
cobweb Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 I find this whole story baffling and a little ridiculous. Is Bouder really so up in arms over not dancing opening night? Really? And IMHO, this makes Stafford look like a weak leader, if not a complainer. Link to comment
abatt Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, cobweb said: I find this whole story baffling and a little ridiculous. Is Bouder really so up in arms over not dancing opening night? Really? And IMHO, this makes Stafford look like a weak leader, if not a complainer. Yes, he definitely comes off as a weak leader. However, since they seem to be looking for a kinder and gentler leader to run the company - someone who is not "mean" to use Bouder's word- Stafford fits the bill. There are numerous comments on Bouder's instagram praising her, but nobody seems to care that she insulted Hyltin. Edited February 22, 2019 by abatt Link to comment
Drew Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) I don’t think Bouder insulted Hyltin...(Hyltin is one of my favorites)....she just wasn’t very tactful about the politics. Better if she left Hyltin out of it of course. I assume emotions are running high. The issue seems to be the lateness of the casting change-up by Martins. (I am basing that in Stafford’s comment that he had considered the casting settled.) Even if one prefers Hyltin as Aurora—and some do— change-ups of that kind do raise questions—rightly or wrongly—about ballet politics. The company is in an odd situation right now and, for the ballet world anyway, Bouder IS quite outspoken. I don’t know if I think of Stafford speaking out as an indication of “weakness” or just his sending a signal about what is not sustainable in the current leadership structure. Whoever the next Director is going to be, and however well the company is dancing, the situation could use some resolution.... Edited February 22, 2019 by Drew Link to comment
E Johnson Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 I'm a little troubled by the suggestion that Bouder is the bad actor here. Martins did something that at least looks petty and vengeful and apparently his going backstage upset dancers who aren't Bouder. Her calling this out is a reaction to him doing what he did, and the suggestion that she be quiet and keep things smooth instead sits badly with me. Should she have impugned Hyltin's abilities? No. But its not clear to me she did. Link to comment
dirac Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 24 minutes ago, Drew said: I don’t know if I think of Stafford speaking out as an indication of “weakness” or just his sending a signal about what is not sustainable in the current leadership structure. Same thing, it seems to me. If Stafford is beefing to the Times, it means the situation is out of his control, which indicates a weakness in his position. (Perhaps he is releasing his inner Karen Black: " There's no one left to fly the plane! I can't fly this plane! Help us! Oh, my God, help us!") Link to comment
nanushka Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 1 minute ago, dirac said: Same thing, it seems to me. If Stafford is beefing to the Times, it means the situation is out of his control, which indicates a weakness in his position. (Perhaps he is releasing his inner Karen Black: " There's no one left to fly the plane! I can't fly this plane! Help us! Oh, my God, help us!") There’s a weakness of leadership that’s inherent in the structure of an organization and there’s a weakness of leadership that’s inherent in the character of the leader. I don’t think those are the same thing. Link to comment
Rock Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 I don't think Stafford's comments are a sign of weakness, but rather a sign of strength. He's no fool and I don't think he'd have been that outspoken unless he had the Board at his back. My guess is they're going to hire him and he knows it. I'll say again I think it's a shame that this sort of thing is what interests the NYT and its readers. Link to comment
balletforme Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 Stafford is being thrown under the bus, IMO. He can't win. The organization appears to be in disarray. And Martins should depart with class. If there are any actors who lack class it is him. Sad, really. Link to comment
Rock Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 And I think you're wrong. I think Stafford can win. And should. Link to comment
vipa Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 25 minutes ago, Drew said: I don’t think Bouder insulted Hyltin...(Hyltin is one of my favorites)....she just wasn’t very tactful about the politics. Better if she left Hyltin out of it of course. I assume emotions are running high. The issue seems to be the lateness of the casting change-up by Martins. (I am basing that in Stafford’s comment that he had considered the casting settled.) Even if one prefers Hyltin as Aurora—and some do— change-ups of that kind do raise questions—rightly or wrongly—about ballet politics. The company is in an odd situation right now and, for the ballet world anyway, Bouder IS quite outspoken. IMO Bouder's belief that retribution was the only possible explanation for giving opening night of SB to Hyltin, is an affront to Hyltin even if unintended. Thank goodness Hyltin had the good sense not to comment. What was she supposed to say - Ashley's right, I didn't deserve it or Ashley's wrong I deserved it? Casting was changed late, but before any public announcement was made. Link to comment
aurora Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, vipa said: IMO Bouder's belief that retribution was the only possible explanation for giving opening night of SB to Hyltin, is an affront to Hyltin even if unintended. Thank goodness Hyltin had the good sense not to comment. What was she supposed to say - Ashley's right, I didn't deserve it or Ashley's wrong I deserved it? Casting was changed late, but before any public announcement was made. The article is clear that certain dancers "own" opening nights of specific ballets. Hyltin gets R+J. And apparently Bouder *was* cast for opening night of SB as per usual until it was changed "last minute." Seeing that as an affront says virtually nothing about Hyltin's abilities. Since Bouder was still cast, and therefore it wasn't a reflection on her ability to do the role, the fact she takes it as an intentional slap in the face and retaliation seems totally reasonable to me. I would as well in her shoes. I don't take Bouder's comment to be a slighting of Hyltin. What she said about her own response to Martins vs Hyltin's is accurate--and I'm sure Hyltin is happy to own that she supported Martins, just as Bouder is happy to own her views. Edited February 22, 2019 by aurora Clarity Link to comment
canbelto Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 FWIW, Hyltin has indicated on her instagram that she's dropped R+J. Link to comment
vipa Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 14 minutes ago, canbelto said: FWIW, Hyltin has indicated on her instagram that she's dropped R+J. Yes Hyltin dropped R+J and Mearns dropped Lilac. Both without explanation. About a year or so ago Mearns dropped Dew Drop. Link to comment
nanushka Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 14 minutes ago, vipa said: Yes Hyltin dropped R+J and Mearns dropped Lilac. Both without explanation. Mearns actually just recently posted about dropping Lilac on her IG: Link to comment
canbelto Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 Hyltin's post about dropping Juliet: Link to comment
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