Sign of the times?

[Farrell Fan]

In the Jeopardy "Teen Tournament," now going on, none of the contestants knew that Nijinsky was a dancer.

[carbro]

Not surprising, FF.

but a worse sign of the decay of culture (albeit popular), the 20-something investment banker who moved into my building recently did not recognize the names Alan Alda or "Peter Yarrow, you know -- Puff the Magic Dragon." A blank.

[bart]

All you really need to win fame and fortune is to be able to answer "Yes" to the question: "Are You Smarter Than a Fifth Grader?"

That's someone born in 1998 or so, I believe.

[Hans]

Or maybe, "have you had more education than a fifth grader and how much of it do you remember?"

[cubanmiamiboy]

Oh, well...what about the fact that i sometimes have to explain to some of my clients that Cuba, where i am from, IS NOT A COUNTRY SITUATED ANYWHERE WITHIN THE CONTINENTAL SOUTH AMERICA, AS SOME SEEMS TO STRONGLY BELIEVE, BUT RATHER AN ISLAND JUST A FEW MILES AWAYS SOUTH OF SOUTH FLORIDA?!?!?! Talk about fifth grade geography.

[Ray]

Some figures whom I was shocked that college-educated young people didn't know:

Marian Anderson

J. Edgar Hoover

Tony Kushner

Also:

++That Bono is Irish ("isn't he Italian?")!

++Martin Luther King freed the slaves

[cubanmiamiboy]

Well, now that we're on the subject, i've found that quite a few of these "college educated" people don't even know who was the first man to orbit the earth, (to go to the outer space). For some reason A LOT of them keep mentioning Armstrong, instead of the soviet Yury Gagarin (1961).Go figure...

[ngitanjali]

As one of those "youngsters" that does know who Nijinsky is, and actually knew the answers to/about most of those examples listed above, I'd like to just say that there are those of us who crave knowledge and culture and staying connected to everything! Don't lose hope, please!

[cubanmiamiboy]

As one of those "youngsters" that does know who Nijinsky is, and actually knew the answers to/about most of those examples listed above, I'd like to just say that there are those of us who crave knowledge and culture and staying connected to everything! Don't lose hope, please!

Lovely!!...yes, there's still hope on earth...

[Klavier]

In the Jeopardy "Teen Tournament," now going on, none of the contestants knew that Nijinsky was a dancer.

Don't feel bad. In the regular adult shows, most of the contestants can provide only a few of the classical music questions.

[Dale]

I work with a 27-year-old who never heard of Laurence Olivier. Another late 20-something co-worker was surprised that I knew some fact about World War II, saying "Wow, you're older than I thought." I was "Dude, I was born nearly 30 years after World War II ended but I read." It's very big at the office to make fun of any "old" person (old being anybody older than 29). But after feeling bad the first few times, I fired back, "You know, I wouldn't brag about being ignorant." There seems to be this feeling that if they weren't old enough to remember it happening, then they shouldn't want/need to know about it.

[Farrell Fan]

There seems to be this feeling that if they weren't old enough to remember it happening, then they shouldn't want/need to know about it.

That feeling has been around a long time now. I was walking past the lions in front of the NY Public Library once some thirty years ago and mentioned to a co-worker that they were named "Patience and Fortitude" which had also been the motto of Mayor Fiorello LaGuardia. Of course he'd never heard of LaGuardia. "That was before I was born," he said, as though explaining everything

[bart]

" ... but I read."

Dale, you may have put your finger on the biggest difference!

ngnitanjali, thanks for reminding us that many younger people are in fact interested in and aware of the past. You and your contemporaries who share your interests are a precious resource.

[dirac]

I had a conversation with a younger person in my family circle about Showtime’s very enjoyable “The Tudors." We both like the show, although I drew her attention to various ways in which the series departed from the historical record and she said, “How do you know all that?” I had to bite my tongue to refrain from saying, “Those things are all hidden away in books. Fiendishly clever system, isn’t it?”

However, I do try to remind myself that “What is the younger generation coming to?” reflections are an infallible sign of aging. All older generations tend to think that the young folks are arrogant, ignorant, and going to hell in a handbasket generally, and it may very well be true in some ways, yet somehow each successive generation seems to manage.

[artspatron07]

Recently I conversed with a college educated acquaintance regarding the cultural opportunities in Vienna. He thought Vienna was located in the Netherlands! Two of his teenage children (including his daughter who is preparing to attend college this term) also believed Vienna was located in the Netherlands. I very politely informed them that Vienna is located in Austria.

Is geography outdated in our education system? What ever happened to identifying international cities on the globe in grade school?

[bart]

Recently I conversed with a college educated acquaintance regarding the cultural opportunities in Vienna. He thought Vienna was located in the Netherlands! [ ... ] Is geography outdated in our education system?

Am I hoping to much to think that this may have been a confused memory of the "Austrian Netherlands," a polity that existed in the 18th century? This would make them quite erudite, actually. But maybe I'm stretching it a bit .... ?

[kfw]

Recently I conversed with a college educated acquaintance regarding the cultural opportunities in Vienna. He thought Vienna was located in the Netherlands! Two of his teenage children (including his daughter who is preparing to attend college this term) also believed Vienna was located in the Netherlands. I very politely informed them that Vienna is located in Austria.

Is geography outdated in our education system? What ever happened to identifying international cities on the globe in grade school?

And more than that, how small their conception must be of each place's history, culture, cuisine, terrain, etc. Then again, they may have forgotten more than I'll ever know about rain forests.

[bart]

And more than that, how small their conception must be of each place's history, culture, cuisine, terrain, etc. Then again, they may have forgotten more than I'll ever know about rain forests.

Based on my skimming of a Global Studies textbook used by 10th graders in New York state and issued by a major publisher, a number of these topics actually ARE being taught, though in a superficial manner.

What is not being taught are the politics, economics, and real power relationships. You are much more likely to learn, in an American high school, how to make a classic Mexican dish, how to recognize a mariachi band, or the names of popular holidays, than the long stressful and rather important history of the relatiionship between Mexico and the U.S.

As for the higher arts -- they do not exist in such books, unless it be a very brief paragraph (usually in boxed form) devoted to someone like Mozart or equivalent household name.

Magnificent history courses continue to be taught at the better US universities, but most are elective, and the predominant attitude even in the most elite schools is much less prone to see such courses as being necessary if you want to consider yourself to be "educated." Few corporate careers have been launched on the ability to recongize Nijinksy. Or Mozart for that matter. Alas.

So ... some students graduate from university having learned about these hings and wishing to spend their lives learning more, while many graduate with equally prestigious degrees knowing very little.

[Juliet]

Now you all know how librarians feel at the end of every day.

[aurora]

Now you all know how librarians feel at the end of every day.

And teachers. Who have to read grammatical horrors written by undergraduates!

[Helene]

It's a good thing I have enough gray in my hair to make memory loss a plausible explanation

[aurora]

It's a good thing I have enough gray in my hair to make memory loss a plausible explanation

Hehe. I don't (or at least I get rid of it). My excuse on geographical matters is that somehow I was never actually taught it!

I still have trouble understanding how college students have no idea of what a halo is, regardless of their religious background. But, there are some (I've seen the papers!) who don't!

I've also read a nice little piece which accused the artist of being a "satin worshipper". But I suppose with spell check, that is to be expected.

[carbro]

I very politely informed them that Vienna is located in Austria.

Right. Where the kangaroos are.

What is not being taught are the politics, economics, and real power relationships. You are much more likely to learn, in an American high school, how to make a classic Mexican dish, how to recognize a mariachi band, or the names of popular holidays, than the long stressful and rather important history of the relatiionship between Mexico and the U.S.

Maybe the authors see food and music as a first step towards understanding the more complex and abstract (and necessary) socio-politico-economic issues. But I somehow recall studying food and music of other cultures (ca. 1960) as part of my fourth or fifth grade public school social studies classes.

Now you all know how librarians feel at the end of every day.

But most of us don't have to deal with it every day -- I hope.

[ngitanjali]

I'm a current undergraduate and I think I'd quit college from shame of a grammar mistake. Some things, are, in my opinion, unacceptable. As for books, yes, media is available and easy to find online, and most of it is mind-numbing (reality TV...), but I wouldn't be able to live without my library, complete with books on every topic imaginable and amassed over a lifetime (and counting). As I wrote in a recent college essay, I have discussed life with Plato, journeyed to Rome, witnessed Marie Antoinette's execution, been inspired by Monet, and shared happiness and sorry with so many characters. A life without books and art and culture is empty and meaningless.

As for knowing and understanding the past. It is inexcusable NOT to know our heritage. We need to remember the good AND the bad, for understanding erases ignorance, which is the source of so many problems.

Sorry if this is off topic, I'm just so passionate about this this subject. Fortunately for me, my closest friends feel the exact same way, and dinner conversations have ranged from the Saxon Kings, to Balanchine, to Callas and Tebaldi, to Chomsky. Once again, there are few of us, but we are a strong, loud, and passionate crew

ng

[Hans]

However, I do try to remind myself that “What is the younger generation coming to?” reflections are an infallible sign of aging. All older generations tend to think that the young folks are arrogant, ignorant, and going to hell in a handbasket generally, and it may very well be true in some ways, yet somehow each successive generation seems to manage.

So what does it mean when you're 25 and think that about your own generation? Like ngitanjali, I am very thankful for my like-minded friends!