Favorite movie romance?

[oberon]

MAURICE isn't a great film, but it's very romantic imho.

I've always wished someone would make Mary Renault's THE PERSIAN BOY...there was talk of it in the 70s for Michael York but it never materialized. Instead we got ALEXANDER, which is both mostly miscast and doesn't know what kind of movie it wants to be.

THE PERSIAN BOY is one of the most romantic novels I ever read. As was DANCER FROM THE DANCE - but if someone were to make a film of that, it would almost be a period piece at this point.

[dirac]

oberon writes:

As was DANCER FROM THE DANCE - but if someone were to make a film of that, it would almost be a period piece at this point.

You're right, Maurice is very romantic -- too romantic, perhaps.

We are veering off topic, but yes, Holleran was doing serious channeling of F. Scott Fitzgerald. Too bad the subject matter was/is untouchable for Hollywood -- Redford would have made a fine Malone, back in the seventies. Of course, he was too busy flirting with Paul Newman.

[Petra]

GWTW writes: Maybe we need a new topic for favourite gay love/sex scenes.

I think not. A romance-based topic is fine, but we don't want to get too specific.

I certainly wouldn't want to do anything that would cause my company's IT security system to prevent me from accessing this board during work hours!!

[Mashinka]

I've always wished someone would make Mary Renault's THE PERSIAN BOY...

As a Mary Renault fan, Ive always preferred her Last of the Wine, perhaps the BBC might give us a dramatized version of it in time for the 2012 Olympics. I re-read the book every time I go to Athens.

[dirac]

I love Mary Renault too, Mashinka. (Stone's "Alexander" steals from her shamelessly, although not the best stuff, unfortunately.)

[canbelto]

I saw both Ninotchka and Camille, and must admit that while Ninotchka lived up to expectations, Camille was a disappointment. I think at that point in time George Cukor simply wasnt a very skilled director -- all his scenes go on for too long, and the way he keeps the camera fixated on Garbo during nearly every shot gets tiring. I mean, she's beautiful, but the soft-focus fixation ruins any momentum or tension in the film. Particularly snail-paced are the country-side scenes. And then there's Robert Taylor. Oh, the poor guy. Looks good, can't act out of a paper bag. I think the only really good scenes are ironically between Marguerite and the Baron -- the scene when they laugh hysterically as they play the piano, or the scene when she flatly asks him for money and he slaps her across the face, and she smirks. I think Garbo's good in this film, but the film overall reeks of MGM artificiality.

[dirac]

Thank you for reporting back! Hmmmm......at this period, Cukor was the favored director of the producer David O. Selznick and had already directed one of MGM’s biggest productions to date, “Dinner at Eight.” He also had “Little Women,” “David Copperfield,” and several other high profile productions under his belt. So he was pretty well versed at this point. (As a rule, the pacing of thirties movies tends to be brisker than those of today, but we’re not accustomed any more to the longer scenes and medium two shots that were also typical of the “Golden Age.”) Garbo’s movies are classics primarily because she is in them, alas. In the case of Camille, MGM’s great fields of artificial flowers are distracting, Taylor is inadequate, Lionel Barrymore makes one want to sprint for the exits, and Henry Daniell, as you observe, is almost the only other actor in the cast apart from Garbo who has the right feeling and sense of style for his role. (I didn’t find the pacing slow, but that’s just a difference of opinion. As for focusing too much on Garbo – well, it’s one of the greatest performances ever to make it to celluloid, and I never tire of gazing at the lady myself, so there you go.)

The following is also a matter of taste, but I thought Ninotchka was, apparently unintentionally, a rather cynical picture. We don’t see the West as a place of liberty and opportunity, but as one where people correctly positioned can enjoy expensive consumer goods and live frivolously without doing anything in particular to earn or deserve their pleasures. Ninotchka has to learn to focus less on advances in industrial technology and more on clothes. It’s certainly more attractive than the gulags and forced collectivization, but it’s still not a pretty view, not to me anyway. Melvyn Douglas is charming and Garbo is very touching (and it’s great to see her square off against that great comedienne of the stage, Ina Claire), but the movie left me with an unpleasant feeling.

[canbelto]

Dirac, I think the "Lubitsch touch" ironically was his lack of sentimentality. I've noticed this in his other films too. He films romance with a cool clinical eye, and that's part of the charm. For instance, in "Shop Around the Corner" Kralik (James Stewart) and Klara (Margaret Sullavan) aren't secretly adorable bunnies. They are quite insufferable and pretentious. In contrast, "You've Got Mail" strives hard to make Tom Hanks and Meg Ryan super-cute, which is why it's an inferior movie.

In "Ninotchka," what I see is an admittance that both the super-shallow Frenchmen and the dour Russians can learn from each other. Leon (Melvyn Douglas) is attracted to Ninotchka not only because she, well, looks like Greta Garbo (who wore no makeup in her early scenes) but because he sees in Ninotchka what is lacking in the French bimbos. Namely, intelligence and depth. But mostly I just think Garbo's performance is divine. I love the little touches -- the way she shakes her head at the French hat. The way during the diner scene she repeatedly dips her bread into the soup. How she shakes the hands of the three Russian dudes, each with a closed, clipped, "Comrade." Garbo in real life was really a pretty dull woman, and sometimes I think she hid her dullness behind the famous reclusiveness. But like Marilyn Monroe or James Dean she quite literally lights up the screen. Ninotchka was the first film I saw of Garbo, and right away I understood the magic.

The only actress today that comes close to Garbo's radiance is Zhang Ziyi, who's also a natural scene-stealer. I just saw "2046" and without Zhang Ziyi I think the movie would have been simply a rather shallow movie about emotional emptiness. But Zhang Ziyi made it about so much more. Her heartbreak broke MY heart.

[Old Fashioned]

The only actress today that comes close to Garbo's radiance is Zhang Ziyi, who's also a natural scene-stealer. I just saw "2046" and without Zhang Ziyi I think the movie would have been simply a rather shallow movie about emotional emptiness. But Zhang Ziyi made it about so much more. Her heartbreak broke MY heart.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No offense, but I just choked on my chocolate truffle when I read that.

[canbelto]

Ok I saw Queen Christina tonight and really enjoyed it. The movie moves along at a remarkably fast clip, and I like the pre-Hays code raunchiness (Garbo kissing another woman on the lips, Garbo and Gilbert sharing a bed in the inn). If one can ignore the fact that John Gilbert is about as Spanish as ... well, an egg roll, then the romance between Christina and the Spaniard is very enjoyable. I love the scene when Garbo lies down, chomping on a cluster of grapes.

[dirac]

Garbo could have had Olivier for Queen Christina, but she insisted on Gilbert out of loyalty – his career had tanked, in part because Gilbert had incurred L.B. Mayer’s wrath by backing Garbo in her salary disputes with the studio. I’m not sure Olivier at that point in his development would have been that much better – he was awfully callow then – but it would have been an interesting pairing.

I haven't seen "2046" yet, but I may as well confess that after sitting through "In the Mood for Love" it's not high on my to-do list......

[EvilNinjaX]

Since so much of ballet has to do with romance, I was just wondering what are y'all's favorite movie romances. I'm a big sucker for romances, and my favorites are:

A few of mine (foreign):

IL MARE (Korea) - currently being remade in the US starring Sandra Bullock and Keanu Reeves. Romantic melodrama. It's like FREQUENCY crossed with SHOP AROUND THE CORNER.

SHALL WE DANSU ? (Japan) - original director's cut is 20min longer than the Miramax US edit and is much better.

MY SASSY GIRL (Korea) - RomCom about a normal college guy who meets a somewhat crazed girl who gets him into all kinds of trouble.

MY LITTLE BRIDE (Korea) - RomCom about a forced marriage b/w a 22yo college student and a 16yo high school girl and the humorous situations they face.

LAST PRESENT (Korea) - melodrama. Echoes of GIFT OF THE MAGI. A woman has terminal illness and before she dies, she wants to give her husband a last present: getting him a chance to be a successful comedian. Meanwhile, he finds out about the illness and looks to give her a final present: a reunion wiht her first and only true love.

CHRISTMAS IN AUGUST (Korea) - Understated drama about a man who owns a camera store and a female meter maid.

BE WITH YOU (Japan) - A year after she dies, a young woman returns to her husband and child to stay with them for the duration of the rainy season. She doesn't have any memories and so they relive them together. Painfully tender and beautiful. Set to be remad ein the US starring Jennifer Garner.

LOVER'S CONCERTO (Korea) - A young college student meets two girls and falls in love with one at first sight, but she doesn't (at first) return the feelings. The three of them form an inseparable friendship, though,...

OASIS (Korea) - painfully awkward romance b/w a girl with cerebral palsy and a man just released from prison. it's a too-realistic film about the troubles both these people face and the less-than-romantic love that blooms.

GIRL ON THE BRIDGE (France) - Patrice Leconte. About a knife thrower who rescues a "bad luck girl" from jumping off a bridge. Together, they brign each other good luck... for a while.

INITIMATE STRANGERS (France) - Patrice Leconte. A woman looking for counseling accidentaly enters the wrong office and starts talking to a tax accountant, who (puzzled) listens to her. This leads to a strange relationship...

HANA AND ALICE (Japan) - About two mid school girls and their friendship and the love that comes into Hana's life. As a bonus, they are both ballet students and a marvelous scene near the end depicts how much Alice loves ballet.

HE LOVES ME HE LOVES ME NOT - Audrey Tautou. She's in an affair with a married man and it's not quite what she seems to think it is.

LOVE LETTER (Japan) - Shunji Iwai. About a woman who relives the love of her past thru a strange correspondence. Touching and beautiful if you can accept the premise.

MESSENGERS (Japan) - ROmcom about a high society girl who is forced to become a bicycle messenger.

ONLY YESTERDAY (Japan) - Ghibli animated film. About a woman accountant who returns to the countryside of her youth and finds what was missing in her life.

NELLY AND MR. ARNAUD (France) - Emmanuelle Beart. An aging man hires a beautiful young woman as he dictates his life story. The Relationship blossoms but is handled delicately and in a nice understated manner.

CRYING OUT LOVE IN THE CENTER OF THE WORLD (Japan) - Love affair taking place in high school as two young lovers send audio cassettes back and forth.

TWILIGHT SAMURAI (Japan) - Mostly a love story about a low-end widowed samurai and the woman who comes to care for him and his children.

WHEN I TURNED NINE (Korea) - Echoes of 400 BLOWS. A 9 year old's life in a poor town filled with characters, including the new girl at school with whom he doesn't get along...

-goro-

[dirac]

Thanks, EvilNinjaX, for those titles, some of whom may not be known to Stateside moviegoers. That Jennifer Garner remake doesn't sound promising.

[canbelto]

This weekend I watched the commentary track to Casablanca. It's Roger Ebert, and it's one of the most enjoyable commentary tracks I've ever listened to. Ebert points out that it's Paul Henreid's stiff portrayal of Victor that makes Casablanca a real romance: Victor's such a humorless stiff that it's natural for Ilsa to love Rick. Ebert has a great line about Henried "acting from the back of his eyeballs," as he always seemed to be looking up at the cue cards during scenes. Ebert should do more of these commentary tracks -- he always has interesting things to say, unlike (cough cough) Peter Bogdanovich.

I also saw Notorious recently, and think it's a great (if twisted) romance. Or should I say love triangle, because Claude Rains' Alex is a three-dimensional, sympathetic character. Ah, so many great moments in the movie. My favorite: in the cellar, when Dev and Alicia have to cover their tracks by kissing. They kiss, and it cuts away to Alex, and then to Dev and Alicia again, and by then it's obvious that they are not just "play acting," they are really making out. Ah, the old movies were so good at making "a kiss not just a kiss."

[Helene]

I have to add my thanks, and now I have a two-year project to see many of these movies. Oasis was shown at the Seattle International Film Festival and seemed to be a lightening rod for opposing opinions. I loved The Girl on the Bridge -- I find Daniel Auteuil irresistable, anyway -- and I think the scene in the train station is one of the most erotic scenes in film, and not a single wisp of clothing is shed.

[EvilNinjaX]

I have to add my thanks, and now I have a two-year project to see many of these movies.  Oasis was shown at the Seattle International Film Festival and seemed to be a lightening rod for opposing opinions.  I loved The Girl on the Bridge  -- I find Daniel Auteuil irresistable, anyway -- and I think the scene in the train station is one of the most erotic scenes in film, and not a single wisp of clothing is shed.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OASIS is quite a controversial film and not necessarily an enjoyable one (depending on how much you need to EMPATHIZE with a character in order to enjoy a film). However, it is a masterful one. The acting by the two leads, the direction, the little nuances, the powerful elements of plot that are handled effortlessly and subtley are all sublime. It does meander a bit near the end of the 2nd act and as a result feels a touch overlong (since it's more a character and tone piece, it's not plot-driven and so tends to such). It is part of Lee Chang-Dong's marvelous 3 film series (not related), which also includes PEPPERMINT CANDY and GREEN FISH. I find the 3 all worth seeing (though the other two aren't Romances and so weren't mentioned in the original post).

I think watching Daniel Auteil is absolutely amazing. He's truly a gifted actor with a huge range. I recently watched him in 36 QUAI DES ORFEVRES (playing opposite the equally magnificent Gerard Depardieu) and he was amazing again. And i hear that he's got a new movie coming out opposite Charlotte Gainsbourg (*swoon*).

Interestingly, S Korea has been in a huge moviemaking boon the last few years. The most interesting, powerful, energetic films have been comign from there and it's added great freshness to World Cinema.

If you have any trouble finding any of these or if you want any more recommendations, feel free to lmk, as Asian (and Foreign in general) films are my OTHER big passion. i spend most of my effort and $ these days acquiring Asian DVDs. !

( in case you're interesting, here's a shameless plug for my Asian movies blog:

http://evilninjax.typepad.com )

btw, I'm jealous tha tyou're able to get to SIFF. I'm here in Zona and there's not much...

-goro-

[Estelle]

I think watching Daniel Auteil is absolutely amazing.  He's truly a gifted actor with a huge range.  I recently watched him in 36 QUAI DES ORFEVRES (playing opposite the equally magnificent Gerard Depardieu) and he was amazing again.  And i hear that he's got a new movie coming out opposite Charlotte Gainsbourg (*swoon*).

About Daniel Auteuil, it is quite interesting to realize that the French audience mostly knew him at first because of his roles in some movies by Claude Zidi "Les sous-doués" and its sequels, and it were some really bad movies (about some silly and lazy students who are in a special high school and have to graduate from high school, and use any possible way of cheating); it is fortunate that he had such a more interesting and richer career later.

I'd say that Gérard Depardieu was a great actor... but alas most of his choices in the last 10 years or so have been quite dreary.

[dirac]

I just saw Auteuil in Cache and he was amazing in that (so was Juliette Binoche).

Crossing Delancey was mentioned more than once on this thread and elsewhere, so I thought I'd mention that it is supposed to be released on DVD some time this year, although I'm not sure of the date. Apparently there has been significant popular demand for it.

[Helene]

I just saw Auteuil in Cache and he was amazing in that (so was Juliette Binoche).

-- We agree on a movie-related topic

Crossing Delancey was mentioned more than once on this thread and elsewhere, so I thought I'd mention that it is supposed to be released on DVD some time this year, although I'm not sure of the date. Apparently there has been significant popular demand for it.

I just love Peter Riegert.

[Ed Waffle]

canbelto wrote:

The only actress today that comes close to Garbo's radiance is Zhang Ziyi, who's also a natural scene-stealer. I just saw "2046" and without Zhang Ziyi I think the movie would have been simply a rather shallow movie about emotional emptiness. But Zhang Ziyi made it about so much more. Her heartbreak broke MY heart.

I couldn’t agree more about Zhang Ziyi as a natural scene stealer. An example of this was the movie “Hero” in which her character was infatuated with Broken Sword played by Tony Leung Chiu Wai and whose competition was Flying Snow, played by Maggie Cheung. Maggie Cheung learned movie acting the way a lot of Hong Kong actresses in the 1980s did—in front of the camera. As one of a huge number of young, attractive and possibly talented actors who were thrown onto movie sets in Hong Kong by directors who might be shooting two or even three features at the same time, she understood that she had to stand out quickly from the crowd which she did through a combination of talent, quirkiness and very hard work. She became and remains on of the top box office draws in the Chinese language cinema and has been in seventy-five movies, many of them wonderful, many of them barely watchable. But she knows as well as anyone how to dominate a scene, as does Tony Leung Chiu Wai.

Zhang Ziyi, with less screen time, much less to do and without a huge, defining scene—Maggie has at least two that I can recall just now—is remembered by many as the star (with Jet Li) of the picture. The camera loves her. It helps that she has the kind of beauty that makes men fall all over themselves if she looks twice at them, as did Garbo, but she also has an indefinable, at least by me, presence that draws the audience to her.

dirac wrote:

I haven't seen "2046" yet, but I may as well confess that after sitting through "In the Mood for Love" it's not high on my to-do list......

After sitting through “In the Mood for Love” several times in the past year and planning to do so for whatever years remain to me, I also hesitate to see “2046”, deciding in advance that no matter how good it would be just about impossible to come up to the standard of “In the Mood for Love” and that it would be impossible for one (at least this one) not to compare the two.

“In the Mood for Love” is a movie in which nothing happens—although much could happen, given its themes, setting and characters. It isn’t so much what doesn’t take place but the exquisite delicacy and pace in which irreversible actions are approached and then declined that made it a movie I love. Plus all the different cheongsam worn by Maggie Cheung’s character—they alone were worth the price of admission.

Edited March 17, 2006 by Ed Waffle

[Quiggin]

Ed, "2046" is a must see, pretty much up there with "In the Mood for Love." It has some references to "Days of Being Wild" as well. All three are filmed by the eccentric Australian cameraman Christopher Doyle, who fully collaborates in the look and feel and smell of Wong Kar Wai's films. Doyle says somewhere that they're both jazz fans and they want their movies to be the visual equivalent of jazz solos.

[dirac]

To each his own. With all due respect, I thought Leung looked like a walk-on gigolo in a Warner Brothers production from the thirties (I did break down and see 2046), and it was unclear to me why the small army of mannequins fell for him like the proverbial ninepins.

Helene writes: I just love Peter Riegert.

Ditto. I thought the pickle guy as written was hopelessly implausible, but Riegert made him believable. I thought Amy Irving didn't deserve him. He was great in Local Hero, too. It was a shock to me a few years ago when he popped up in the short-lived series Sports Night as Peter Krause’s graying dad.

We agree on a movie-related topic.

Let's hope it's a trend.

[Helene]

I thought the pickle guy as written was hopelessly implausible, but Riegert made him believable. I thought Amy Irving didn't deserve him. He was great in Local Hero, too. It was a shock to me a few years ago when he popped up in the short-lived series Sports Night as Peter Krause’s graying dad.

I must see Sports Night -- I missed it. Local Hero is one of my all-time favorite movies, mostly because of his performance. One of my favorite moments is when he's dancing with Stella at the ceildh, and he gives a self-conscious little look when he's dipping her. His character can never just be in the moment.

One of the nice things about Crossing Delancey was that he addresses the implausibility of his character directly. I agree that Amy Irving's character didn't deserve him, but she's whom he wanted.

[carbro]

Sports Night was the best half-hour network sitcom of the past decade. Created and written by Aaron Sorkin (great dialogue!), it featured a superb cast (including a recognizably neurotic Felicity Huffman, and a wise and even tempered Robert Guillaume). I blame ABC for its untimely demise -- no promotion whatsoever.

I am inspired to see if it's been released in dvd. Thanks, dirac, for mentioning it!

[canbelto]

I love The Lady Eve too. The chemistry between Stanwyck and Fonda is so strong that I wonder how it got past the censors -- during the entire movie, they can't seem to keep their hands off each other. Stanwyck is wonderful -- sexy, yet very innocent, with that husky voice. I love her real tears when Hopsie dumps her. If ever there was a tough/tender heroine, Jean is it. I love "Lady Eve" with her affected accent and the malicious glean in her eyes. I LOVE the scene on the train, especially after Hopsie jumps off, and you immediately see the regret on Stanwyck's face. And the ending ... one of the most uplifting endings I've ever seen. As they run downstairs on the ship to make love, I got the feeling that they'd truly be one of those 70 year old couples who still held hands. Love that entire movie.