bart Posted July 18, 2005 Posted July 18, 2005 I don't know if this will actually help anyone, but it certainly made me laugh! It's from Sunday's Links: Review for the Clueless. This humorous take on ballet by a reviewer for The Saratogian refers twice to small audiences -- apparently only 1/3 full during the peformance he discusses. Can this be true? Is it typical? If so, it's clear that SPAC is no Tanglewood. Nor Jacob's Pillow. Just how good an idea is this commitment for NYCB? With other companies touring (like San Francisco) or developing long-term relationships with public television (like ABT), why does NYCB -- which rarely tours or appears on public television any more -- continue to devote so much time and so many resources to this rather low-profile engagement?
Farrell Fan Posted July 18, 2005 Posted July 18, 2005 Wow. Months and months of hard work by the people of Saratoga Springs and surrounding areas who love NYCB resulted in at least a qualified victory and will keep NYCB in residency for the foreseeable future. So now you suggest leaving town? Unbelievable.
Hans Posted July 18, 2005 Posted July 18, 2005 I understand Bart's question and don't find the mere asking of it unreasonable. Has NYCB always drawn such small audiences at SPAC or is this fairly recent? Or perhaps this performance was not typical. Yes, Saratoga Springs residents fought to keep NYCB, but are they justifying it by buying tickets? (That's not intended to be a swipe at anyone living in SS; I don't know all the ticket-buyers' circumstances.) All ballet loses money, but it does seem that NYCB could choose options that would lose less while obtaining more national notoriety (as well as affording opportunities for people who don't live in New York to see them).
kfw Posted July 18, 2005 Posted July 18, 2005 Yes, Bart asks an excellent question. Questions of revenue and of building the audience aside though, I'll guess that after all these years the company has a real emotional atttachment to the Saratoga season as a sort of working vacation.
PetipaFan Posted July 18, 2005 Posted July 18, 2005 "I wonder what the story behind this ballet is: I'm a cowboy in a German fetish film? Maybe not. Maybe I should read the program... LIKE THE GUY ACROSS THE AISLE! Hey, the girl dancers all just clapped in unison. This is like bizzaro Riverdance." I don't think Michael Korb 'gets' Agon.
Helene Posted July 18, 2005 Posted July 18, 2005 I don't think this is humorous. It's sexism would be enough, but once again, an author casts ballet as an elitist art for which one needs a PhD to appreciate.
dirac Posted July 18, 2005 Posted July 18, 2005 I’m with Helene. Witless and stupid. Korb wants to toss Whelan a Ritz Bits? Somebody should toss him a brain. Farrell Fan is right in that it does seem rather odd to raise the subject of departure after such a struggle, but on the other hand why shouldn't the company look around for something different and possibly better? We on the West Coast would welcome a more frequent look at NYCB, hint, hint.....
richard53dog Posted July 18, 2005 Posted July 18, 2005 Wow. Months and months of hard work by the people of Saratoga Springs and surrounding areas who love NYCB resulted in at least a qualified victory and will keep NYCB in residency for the foreseeable future. So now you suggest leaving town? Unbelievable. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Not really. Like it or not with government funding and private contributions decreasing each year, any arts institution has to operate more and more according to economics. It's a fine line, but each company, ballet, opera, theater, etc has to spend it's available cash to get the maximum return at the same time retaining it's artistic identity. It would be sad if the NYCB skipped the traditional Saratoga visit, but the budget may be much tighter than when the tradition began. The Met Opera used to tour the country after the NYC season ended. It did this for many, many years. It was a long time tradition but the Met found the the cost had grown too high and had to discontinue it. No one was happy about it but $$$$$ considerations have a way of pushing their into everything. Now if a gazillionaire would commit to underwriting the NYCB visit, that would be a whole different story Richard
perky Posted July 18, 2005 Posted July 18, 2005 Keep the Saratoga seasons going. But is it also too much to ask that NYCB tour it's own country? Not just the two coasts, but also the rest of us? I live 3 1/2 hours from Chicago. I would drive there in a heartbeat to see NYCB.
Mel Johnson Posted July 18, 2005 Posted July 18, 2005 I don't think this is humorous. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> On the other hand, I do. Korb posits himself as Joe Sixpack after the manner of Dave Barry, and the aforesaid Joe is always at least one level of social sophistication below the writer who employs him as a voice.
oberon Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 Dwindling audiences for the performing arts are simply a fact of life in this country. The Metropolitan Opera has been operating for the last 5 or 6 years at far below capacity - only Saturday matinees sell-out, or Renee Fleming. ABT, on the few nights I have been there recently, has acres of empty seats. One night we were given tix by one of the dancers and sat near the rear of the orchestra where there were 7 or 8 rows completely empty...sitting upstairs one can see the big swatches of empty seats on all levels. It does not surprise me in the least that NYCB can't fill SPAC and it is unreasonable to think that they could. It would be lovely if they could do more domestic touring but I assume the various venues would be wary of booking them unless some local patrons gave guarantees. I remember a couple years ago a friend in Hartford called me, dismayed that a Baryshnikov "& Friends" evening had been cancelled due to inadequate sales. Baryshnikov?! Inadequate sales?! I mean, if that name doesn't draw, what dancer would?
Hans Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 Based on the repertoire Baryshnikov currently performs, I wouldn't go see him either.
bart Posted July 19, 2005 Author Posted July 19, 2005 I guess my questions did not speak for themselves. Nor was my real attachment to NYCB -- especially its great, great, unique history -- and wish for it to make its art available to greater numbers of people. I did not intend in any way to suggest anything else. I agree with Perky and assume that many, many fans not fortunate enough to live in or travel regularly in metropolitan NY (or the Adirondacks) would agree. Keep the Saratoga seasons going. But is it also too much to ask that NYCB tour it's own country? I'd add the question of the NYCB's apparent lack of concerned about the distribution of its vision through film (past and future). How can young dancers -- and serious dance lovers who happen to live outside the magic circle -- learn the Balanchine style without seeing it performed at its best? I'd still like to get an idea of whether NYCB and its fans -- including you, Farrell Fan -- consider that the company is doing the right thing by putting so many eggs in this particular Saratoga basket. And if so, why? Oberon makes valid points. But I would think that the company has a responsibility to devise strategies to attempt, at least, to address them. Dwindling audiences for the performing arts are simply a fact of life in this country.... It does not surprise me in the least that NYCB can't fill SPAC and it is unreasonable to think that they could. ... It would be lovely if they could do more domestic touring but I assume the various venues would be wary of booking them unless some local patrons gave guarantees. "Dwindling audiences" -- true. But we are talking about one specific "dwindling audience" in a particular venue which the company has chosen to make its major non-Lincoln Center performance site. Is this the best possible priority? ""It does not surprise me": no, but it DOES surprise me that there's so much passive acceptance of in the cultural communityh, as though lack of audience is always the fault of dumb people or vulgar culture. Wouldn't the dancers and others RATHER bring their art to larger audiences? Wouldn't the big donors feel the same way? "Touring" is costly -- yes, but others do it. And I'd be surprised if wealthy donors would not support it (NYC patriotisim, etc.) if seriously courted. I'm not talking about the old 4-month treks around Europe. And, God knows, NYCB excels in the kind of cost-effective program that doesn't require 80 dancers, elaborate costumes, or cumbersome sets. The old NYCB acted as though they had a mission to expose larger audiences to their Balanchine repertoire, challenging music, and splendid dancers and style. What about the current company?
Farrell Fan Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 When the President and board of the Saratoga Performing Arts Center attempted to get rid of New York City Ballet at the end of last season because they claimed to be losing money on them, the community reacted in a truly inspiring way. Even Peter Martins professed to be touched at how much NYCB was loved in the region. In the end it was the SPAC President and board who had to go. I don't know if attendance has improved any. What I do know is that the subject you brought up, Bart, seemed singularly inappropriate at this time, a slap in the face of all the people who worked so hard to keep NYCB in its traditional summer home.
bart Posted July 19, 2005 Author Posted July 19, 2005 I'm sorry to have hurt feelings by asking questions, and certainly did not mean to offend anyone as deeply as I appear to have done. I've followed the NYCB since the mid-50s. I revere the Balanchine legacy and all those who keep it alive. I think the work -- and the dancers who perform it -- are great treasures that deserve to be shared with as many people as possible. My questions were entirely in that spirit. Thanks, hans, for your own questions.
Helene Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 During the entire fiasco, I myself wondered two things: 1. Would the SPAC situation have turned out in NYCB's favor if Herb Chesbrough's administration had been able to withstand state audit and financial scrutiny and had his position not been a prize political plum? 2. What would be the outcome of the soft murmurings about evaluating the results of this season, which very few seemed to focus on in the post-Chesbrough euphoria? The state did not say that they would become the "angels" of SPAC indefinitely. The new administration made itself clear that NYCB supporters would need to show that support financially, and that they would ask the very same question Bart did, however NYCB fans and supporters feel about that question.
oberon Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 NYCB only spends 3 weeks a year at SPAC. It is not a huge investment of time or energy for them because mostly they do pieces they've just done in NYC so there is not the need for long periods of rehearsals. Audience-building (and audience "keeping") is something all our performing arts institutions are facing. Friends of mine who were Met Opera subscribers for 15 years did not renew for the coming season; they just weren't interested in the rep/singers on offer. It will be interesting to see if those who purchased Sunday matinee NYCB subscriptions for the season just ended in order to be sure to see the farewells of Boal & Soto will renew. Did they see enough "good stuff" to make them want to go back? I wonder how much the availability of DVDs of very fine performances of opera/ballet have caused some people to favor staying home in White Plains on a Friday night to watch Angel & Ferri in ROMEO rather than trekking in to see it "live" at ABT? I imagine hard-core ballet fans will always make the effort to get to live performances, but the more casual ballet-goer might be able to satisfy their need to see dance at home, saving an evening of fighting traffic, parking expense and getting home well after midnight. I did not mean to infer that Baryshnikov at this point is artistically viable, but that his name would be enough of a draw to sustain an engagement in a smaller metropolis. My friend in Hartford is a peripheral dance fan, had never seen Baryshnikov, and was curious. Last year, Nilas Martins took a group of NYCB dancers to Hartford for a single Sunday matinee performance which was, according to friends, well-attended and very enjoyable. But could Hartford sustain a week of NYCB?
richard53dog Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 . Audience-building (and audience "keeping") is something all our performing arts institutions are facing. Friends of mine who were Met Opera subscribers for 15 years did not renew for the coming season; they just weren't interested in the rep/singers on offer. It will be interesting to see if those who purchased Sunday matinee NYCB subscriptions for the season just ended in order to be sure to see the farewells of Boal & Soto will renew. Did they see enough "good stuff" to make them want to go back? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Oberon, I couldn't agree more on cultivating audiences. It's vital on several levels; behinds in the seats, less pressure on the budget, people that could share their enthusiasm with other potential patrons, and finally it's more people to try to make a louder noise about funding cuts by the government. Your comment on the Met Opera is has resonances for me. I also just dropped dropped my 20+ year old subscription for just the same reasons your friends did. I'll get individual tickets for the few performances I really want to see. Richard
oberon Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 If NYCB were to do domestic tours, what cities could support a week-long stay? Places like Chicago, Boston, San Francisco, Seattle, etc have resident ballet companies. Would NYCB coming to town detract from the local company's efforts? How big an audience is there these days for classical ballet in general? Of course hard-core dance fans in those cities would be happy to see both the local company and NYCB but what percentage of seats can be sold to hard-core dance fans? Also, it is not reasonable to compare SPAC to Jacob's Pillow; the Pillow is a very small venue and offers a wide range of dance presentations, from classical to tap. It is close to Tanglewood and people who week-end up there can take in a BSO concert and a Pillow performance on consecutive days. A sold-out house at the Pillow is a mere fraction of a SPAC audience.
Hans Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 Out of curiosity, how does Wolftrap compare to these theaters?
bart Posted July 19, 2005 Author Posted July 19, 2005 Thanks, oberon, for your thoughtful responses to the questions I raised. You've convinced me about SPAC (I was always for keeping the connection). And I can see the problems with US touring -- though numerous non-American companies do it). The lack of interest in video, however, is still perplexing -- especially when other companies like Paris Opera, Royal Ballet, Kirov, etc., are getting quite active in this area. Those of us who love the Balanchine repertoire and have seen how time and distance can bring about changes, whether you approve of them or not, can't help but feel that there should be an ongoing campaign to make a performance record of Balanchine's work. AND to make it available to the young dancers, educators, and audiences of the future. I recently spoke with a young dancer who just completed the Summer Intensive at Harid. She and her home studio -- in Maryland -- are very interested in Balanchine. But other than a few local-ish performances, she's never actually seen Balanchine danced. Ditto our local professional company, whose dancers have performed several Balanchine ballets -- set by visitors from NYC -- but are unfamiliar with virtually ALL the others. They know Balanchine is a great name, but not really WHY. Miami Ballet -- a major preserver/presenter of Balanchine -- has Edward Villella and access to the best Balanchine coaches. Their style is impeccable/ ditto their speed. But the feeling (more legato, more gentle, less urban-intense) is quite different from NYCB in Balanchine's day or even today. So there's work to be done. Whoever does it. Or where.
kfw Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 Miami Ballet -- a major preserver/presenter of Balanchine -- has Edward Villella and access to the best Balanchine coaches. Their style is impeccable/ ditto their speed. But the feeling (more legato, more gentle, less urban-intense) is quite different from NYCB in Balanchine's day or even today. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That's interesting, Bart. I remember a NY Times review some years back in which the reviewer said something to the effect of "the whole company's dancing was reminiscent of Villella's." Formyself, I barely saw NYCB in Balanchine's day, but I haven't noticed the difference you speak of, at least not in Rubies or the black and white ballets.
rkoretzky Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 A sold-out house at the Pillow is a mere fraction of a SPAC audience. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> THANK YOU OBERON. You make an essential point here. In fact, I'll take it a step further: A sold-out house at the NYS Theater is a half-full (or half-empty) house at SPAC. Our theater is 5,200 seats, exactly double the capacity at Lincoln Center. We are tying to fill the equivalent of two theaters in an area with a fraction of the population and a fraction of the financial resources. Guess what? We aren't going to make it, if that is the goal, and if we are held to that goal I guess we should concede right now and turn the NYCB over to someplace else. Give us a break folks! SPAC wasn't destroyed overnight and we can't rebuild it overnight. We are doing our best. In fact I think we are doing very well. I have been at the ballet every night except the gala and at three of the four matinees thus far. The crowds are respectable--yes I would like to see more, but we HAVE a devoted audience and we need to undo years of neglect and begin to develop a bigger audience. Changes are occurring. Slowly. We are at the mercy of the elements. This season we have had scorching heat, oppressive humidity, and torrents of rain. Still our audience comes--again, not at the numbers that I would like but as I said we have rebuilding to do. As for Michael Korb and his calculations--no one here takes Michael Korb seriously. No one. Many of us know him--he is in fact a nice guy who can be hilariously funny. I didn't find this particular column to be one of his best. Not even close. He would laugh out loud at the fact that he was called a "reviewer" and that his piece is a "review". He knows neither of those is true. I know where Michael sits when he comes to SPAC. From his vantage point he can't see the balcony. Lots of people sit up there--many of my balletomane friends prefer it. So the place was likely more full than he thought. I've been to the state theater many times when the house has been disappointingly small. Does anyone suggest that NYCB find a new permanent home? I didn't think so. A million thanks to Farrell Fan and to Oberon for jumping in to defend Saratoga when the inital postings were just too disheartening for me to respond. Edit: Bart and I were posting at the same time. Thanks Bart!
bart Posted July 19, 2005 Author Posted July 19, 2005 I remember a NY Times review some years back in which the reviewer said something to the effect of "the whole company's dancing was reminiscent of Villella's." Formyself, I barely saw NYCB in Balanchine's day, but I haven't noticed the difference you speak of, at least not in Rubies or the black and white ballets. I don't quite know the words for the difference I see -- especially when compared with personal memories of the 50s and 60s supplemented by the few commercial videos of the 70s. But the attack is sharper than Miami. There's a quality of risk-taking, almost despately so in some of Balanchine's 70s videos. That is not there at Miami, though the great attention to detail is. This is not a huge difference, but something I've felt since I first saw Miami -- a company which, incidentally, is wonderful, wonderful.
oberon Posted July 19, 2005 Posted July 19, 2005 Now we read on the Bolshoi forum how that Company's 2-week run at the Met is sold out. Our two "local" companies (ABT & NYCB) bust their butts and perform to houses that are seldom anywhere near packed. So who are the people who are mobbing the box office to see the Russians? Are they bored with Balanchine, listless because Nina's not at ABT, only going because it's "THE BOLSHOI"? Is it because the Bolshoi is so rare here?
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