EricMontreal22

Yes it was--and from photographs of both productions it looks quite faithful. It's too bad they edit it on that great New year's Eve in St Petersburg and serve Champagen on stage instead--though you can see the backdrop and the archways coming down for it. I believe Carabosse and Lilac are featured amongst the gods in the clouds in the back. (The Imperial ballet didn't seem to have much of a problem replacing dancers halfway through a ballet, I know that in one ballet--was it Raymonda?--the ages P Gerdt was replaced as the leading man for the final dance variation by the younger Legat.)

Ismene Brown, a great supporter of the Wright versions, did a great interview with Sir Peter Wright about the authenticity to the original production in his production. Unfortunately the link for it on the Telegraph's website seems to be down--maybe because it's old (it's from 2000) but maybe it's just temporary. The link is at http://www.telegraph.co.uk/et?ac=000148269...8/btnuts18.html If you google Ismene and Wright, Nutcracker you should find quotes. It's an interesting interview although I don't agree with much of Wright's rationale for not using pieces of choreography that do exist. (For instance he calls the reconstructed Garland Waltz in Mariinsky's Sleeping Beauty too boring for modern audiences--I love it partly for how it's simple and repeated and grows from there--and he claims likewise the original Snowflake choreography would bug modern audiences. Similarly he doesn't like the earlier more faithful Waltz of the Flowers--which I prefer, and says the carefully reconstructed Grand Pas De Deux detail of the Fairy gliding en pointe on the cavalier's scarf never worked which is why he removed it shortly after the first DVD was made--yet I LOVE that detail--which we have a picture of in the original 1892 production, etc). Basically a fair bit of dance was kept, or they tried to stage authentically, for the original 80s Royal Ballet production by Wright (the patters, if not steps, of the Snow Scene and Waltz of the Flowers, the dolls dance in Act I, the Chinese dance, and the Grand Pas in complete), but by the time he revised it in the 90s MOST of that was thrown out. I'm very mixed on this production. I love a lot of Act I. I don't care for the new story ideas like the Nutcracker/Droselmeier connection even if they were in the original Hoffman (the ballet is adapted from Alexandre Dumas, pere's simplified adaptation of the Hoffman anyway), I also LOVE all the reconstructed bits, even the somewhat offensive Chinese dance, for their authenticity. I do not like ANY of the changes he made for the more recent stagins--as you can see on the recent DVD--like having Clara and the Prince dance in so many of the divertissements (why?) and I miss some of the charming and more goofy elements--like Mere Gignon. I also think the Kingdom of Sweets colour scheme (pink gold and beige) looks awful on TV although I suspect it probably works a lot better in person. This is all in reference to the 1980s DVD, I have a lot less affection for the revised version. I do find it a bit odd that Wright set out to stage it as close to the original as possible--and then made so many changes, but I suppose this is his prerogative.

OK I that actually makes some sense and would have been obvious to audiences. But do we know for sure how the bee-skep was presented? was it constructed, did it have people in outfit, etc?

The Lezhnina was filmed in Montreal where we don't clap for 5 minutes after every ballerina solo so that may play a part--I haven't seen it (I find it hard to imagine it's better than my beloved Kolpokova DVD) and it's out of print but I am curious why it's listed as so much shorter (just over 2 hours)--maybe those cuts are partly why it's more seamless? I think I'm alone sometimes in liking that Bolshoi DVD. LOL It's not brilliant, and I agree about the Queen (although I don't agree that Aleksei Fadeyechev suffers from close ups--i find him quite handsome) and some of the dancing, but I find Grigorovich's production endlessly fascinating. It probably helps that I've read his whol book (The Authorised Bolshoi Book no less) on the ballet where he explains all his decisions, what's from petipa, what he feels he added back from the original missing in the Kirov's etc--even if I don't agree with the book's claim that it's the best Sleeping Beauty ever--it's far from it and pales next to the Kirov's, the company that was meant to dance it. Still I find it, as a production and on the DVD, a fascinating take on the ballet with a lot to please me (also keep in mind I kinda like the funny wigs, etc, for the old Russian ballets as they feel "rigth" to me)

I've read that Diaghilev changed it to 500 years...

This is an odd topic, I know, but I figure some of you experts can help me out. What's always fascinated me about many of the Imperial Russian ballets is how they almost all had final Apotheosises. Nowadays these Apotheosises are almost always performed as a final moment or pose for the major characters--most Sleeping Beautys have everyone posed around the happy couple, Nutcracker likes to have Clara (with or without her Prince) either flying off or waking up from a dream, Swan Lake has the couple reunited in the heavens, Raymonda is usually similar to Beauty's pose, etc. However when originally performed the apotheosis was much more stylized--it seems to me. I've only seen two--Sleeping Beauty's in its reconstruction and Awakening of Flora's in its reconstruction. Sleeping Beauty the characters remain on stage but the backdrop reveals a scene with Apollo, etc, that I believe is meant to represent the harmony of the court (and be another reference to Louis Quatorze's court). Flora also opens up to a posed scene of Gods, etc. So it seems that for their time the Apotheosis was a living tableau or pose, that while it may have had characters from the piece some how symbolised or represented the ballet. The exception is Swan Lake which I believe has always been the couple in the Heavens (but it was created first for the Bolshoi and not with a libretto by Petipa or anyone else which may be the reason--or maybe in the 1870s they didn't have these apotheosises yet--Bayadere's is fairly simple as is Don Quixote's I believe). Does anyone know about the other famous original apotheosises? In the score for Raymonda I believe the apotheosis is called "the tourney/tournament" which always made me think it was jousting knights or something similar. Nutcracker though has the most fascinating--Beaumont's book describes a Giant beehive with happy bees, representing a succeful community with everyone having their role (these apotheosises also I think were done to a theme that in some way complemented the Tsar). Does ANYONE know how this bizarre apotheosis was staged? it just seems so... random--especially since Tchaikovsky merely returns to the opening Kingdom of Sweets theme in his music. Was it a drawn beehive and bees? Were kids of the chorus dressed as bees? Did the audience get it or were they completely confused? did the rest of the characters stay on stage in front of the beehive, or? Or maybe baumont is wrong and there was no beehive? (I'm sure Wiley's amazing Tchaikovsky's Ballets book has something on this but my copy is across the country in Montreal and I really don't remember).

The Bolshoi performs only one of the added variations (I'm not sure which one as I don't know the music on its own but I think the first one) as a variation for Jean de B. But I'm pretty sure the famous clapping variation comes down--at least fairly close, from the Petipa.

Thanks! That quickly solved a mystery I had for ages--so she was another fairy tale author around the time of Perrault--makes sense. I know his original stories were collected in volumes in France along with stories by others. Here's a synopsis of the story http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Blue_Bird_(fairy_tale) It's quite the story (as of course the original Sleeping Beauty with the Ogress mother of the Prince, etc is as well)

In the Raymonda folder I posted a chronology (apparantly imcomplete) from a book I have The Authorised Book of the Bolshoi Raymonda, by Yuri Grigorovich (translated, quite poorly, into English). I also have the Sleeping Beauty book in this series and was asked to post the chronology of Bolshoi productions--as the book lists them--as well. So here it is (for whatever reason it's more detailed than Raymonda's ): 1 January 17, 1899 - December 28, 1902 Conductor: A Arends Choreography: M Petipa Transfer of the ballet from St Petersburg to Moscow - A Gorsky Designers: K Waltz (Machinery), A Geltzer (panorama), I Savitsky, I Smirnov, P Lebedev, P Sergeyev 47 Performances 2 December 19, 1904 - January 26, 1919 Conductor: Ye Plotnikov Choreography: A Gorsky Original scenery used 71 Performances 3 May 25, 1924 - June 6, 1934 Conductor: Yu Faier Choreography: A Gorsky Revived by V Tikhomirov Designer: A Geltzer 107 Performances 4 December 20, 1936 - January 9, 1945 Conductor: Yu Faier Choreography: A Messerer, A Chekrygin Production directed by B Mordvinov Designer: I Rabinovich 71 Performances 5 April 9, 1952 - February 7, 1958 Conductor: Yu Faier Choreography: A Messerer, M Gabovich Designer: M Obolensky Costumes by L Silich 61 Performances 6 December 7, 1963 - May 5, 1971 Conductor: B Khaikan Production by M Petipa New edition by Yuri Grigorovich Designer: S Virsaladze 59 Performances 7 May 31, 1973 (still in repertoire) Conductor: A Kopylov Choreography: M Petipa Ballet revived and edited by Yu Grigorovich Designer: S Virsaladze The book, like the Raymonda book (there were at least 3 others I don't have for other full length ballets is interesting but with faults. Half of it is a beautifully photographed run through of the full ballet, the other half are a series of essays about the composer, the original production, later Bolshoi productions and then Grigorovich's staging. For Beauty they talk about Grigorovich's first staging which is interesting--in the 60s he had decided that all mime should be cut and only the "glorious dances" of Petipa used so most of the openign and closing scenes of each act were nearly completely cut and the panorama and growth of the forest were shown through dance--and Virsaladze designs a symbolic abstract backdrop all in white. Grigorovich admits that it was a foolish mistake to cut those parts and he didn't understand the ballet. of course then it describes the new production repeatedly as the most glorious, true to Petipa and Tchaikovsky's original intentions yet modern, etc, etc, version of the ballet every done ANYWHERE. It's full of glowing praise (I actually liek the Bolshoi production for some reason--flaws and all but the praise in the text is a bit amusing)

What confused me more about the fairies is the fact that out of all of Perrault's fairy tales, I know Hop O My thumb and other obscure ones that we see in Act III, and I assume the White Cat was just inveneted to duet with Puss--but I've enver found an actual Blue Bird and Princess Florine tale... Anyone know if there's a source to it?

Marie Petipa was also replaced as the Lilac Fairy in Act III I believe--I believe she played either Cinderella or The White Cat in the divertissement.

My pleasure--I'm still new here and trying to get the feel of it, but I love being able to talk about all this kinda stuff--it fascinates me. Check shortly in the Sleeping Beauty folder ;)

It really is. If there's interest I can type out the whole Sleeping Beauty, Bolshoi performance histroy--but maybe I should move it to the Sleeping Beauty forum (and as was mentioned I have no idea how correct it is, even if this is the "Authorised Bolshoi Book" as the author repeatedly says lol).

I'm a little obsessed with all the Petipa ballets from his time in Russia--and have been for at least a dozen years. We know a lot about a number of them--some we have pretty faithful versions of still passed down, and some are more questionable, but what of the lost Petipa ballets do you find the most intriguing? Of course he did so many ballets, the list is almost endless, but... I'm leaving off major revivals of works that originated elsewhere but feel free to suggest some. There are a number I'd love to see bits from (or all)--or at least hear about in more detail. I know that Tsar Kandavl or Le Roi Candaule from the 1860s but revived last by him in 1903 (and notated) was one of his biggest early successes and a huge spectacle, yet I know nothing about it really. People often hold up the important ballets with Tchaikovsky and later Glazunov as rare and great examples of Petipa and the imperial ballet working with "Symphonic composers" It's for this reason some other works with noted, but now forgotten composers, interest me. 1887's Tulipe de Harlaam was staged by Lev Ivanov but with involvement from Petipa and the music was by Baron Boris Fitinhof-Schel, who was in his day a respected composer. I'm not sure if anything's remained from it. In 1893 Baron wrote another ballet, which was staged by Ceccheti and Ivanov under the supervision of Petipa--Cinderella. This work has always fascinated me because I can't help thinking that Petipa or Vseveloshsky considered it a sort of followup to their previous fairy tale ballet--Sleeping Beauty. It also is where Legnanai first did her 32 fouettes yet I know nothing else of it. Going backwards, in 1888 he did The Vestal which was a huge success and many ballet historians claim was a precursor to Sleeping Beauty. It was also done with a symphonic (but mainly forgotten) composer, Mikhail Ivanov. I know some parts were incorporated into a Le Corsair revival 10 years later, and that it was set in Ancient Rome, and nothing else. Also, in 1896 was another Perrault fairy tale ballet, Bluebeard. I've read this was also a success and had some very popular illusions (one was a scene of dance instruction where the corps would be behind a scrim acting as a mirrored reflection), and the score was by Pyotr Schenck. I have no idea how close it stuck to the rather distrubing original fairy tale but I find the idea fascinating. As a Glazunov fan I wish something from his stagins fo the one acts Les Saisons and Russes D'amour remained, although I know versions of Seasons have been performed in Russia a long time and elsewhere. Finally I'd LOVE to know more about the scandalous debacle of his final ballet, 1903's The Magic Mirror with music by opera composer Arseny Koreshchenko. I've read it was a return to the convulated melodramatic storylines he had used in his earlier career, but that's all I know...

Excuse my reply to myself but one thing--if Grigorovich did indeed base his designs on the 1877 production, I wonder if he did for the Shades too. Wikipedia (never too dependable I admit) says this about the original 1877 Shades design compared to the 1900 revival: "Among Petipa's most striking changes for this revival was the change of setting for the scene The Kingdom of the Shades from an enchanted castle in the sky on a fully lighted stage, to a dark rocky landscape at the peaks of the Himalayas." I suspect Grigorovich followed the more familiar later staging...

Oh sorry, my tone didn't make it clear that I was just quoting from the book directly, and didn't mean to imply that this was a correct or exhaustive list. There are pictures credited as the first Gorsky production which show Raymonda in a long dress--no tutu whereas I thought she was always in tutu in the original--but I knwo Gorsky did a lot of experimentation with more natural costumes and this could have no connection to choreography changes. The book was a Russian book (there was a whole series--5 or 6 at least from '87-'89) translated into English, with a lot of text about the original production and the Grigorovich production mainly credited to Grigorovich himself. That said the translation is obviously not done by someone with much familiaryt with English and is in parts laughably bad--and the whole volume is written with both a strong pro Soviet propoganda feel, and emphasis that Grigorovich's production is BY FAR the most brilliant possible--something true of his Sleeping Beauty book too. It's a fascinating read, but between this bias and the poor translations I think there are some factual omissions and errors--probably by accident but I get the sense some might be to downplay the success of earlier productions as well. As for my thought that it looked like, from this list, that Petipa's was never done--you'e right Gorsky's prodcution, specially the first probably was largely Petipa--I was basing my comment because in the Sleeping Beauty book's list of past productions atthe Bolshoi it first lists: 1 January 17, 1899 - Dec 8, 1902 Choreographer M Petipa Transfer of the ballet from St Petersburg - A Gorsky and then 2 December 19, 1904 - January 26-1919 Choreohrapher: A Gorsky and 3 May 25, 1924 - June 6, 1934 Choreorapher: A Gorsky. but the Sleeping Beauty list is longer and more detailed than the Raymonda one in general.

I wasn't even aware of this performance--how does it compare to the Kolpokova? it's about the same length (which means the one you mention being a little over two hours must be edited--I know the panorama is pretty much alwasy dropped on tour but that's only about 4 minutes). It's a bit frustrating that for a while the Kirov seemed very keen on taping their Sleeping Beauty but of course we didn't get anything of their reconstruction...

I have with me the 1987 book The Authorised Bolshoi Ballet Book of Raymonda which is basically about Yuri Grigorovich's production (it was a whole series done in English--I have the Sleeping Beauty one as well). Its focus is on the Bolshoi and this is what it lists for Bolshoi productions of the ballet. Interestingly, it doesn't look liek the original Petipa production was ever done in Moscow. 1 1900-1908 Conductor - A Arends Choreographers - I Khlustin, A Gorsky Designers - K Valtz, P Isskov 2 1908-1915 Conductor - A Arends Choreography - A Gorsky Designer - K Korovin 3 1918-1939 Conductor - Ju. Fayer Choreography - A Gorsky Designer - K Korovin 4 April 7, 1949 Conductor - Yu. Fayer Choreography - A Gorsky, staged in version of L Lavrosky Designer - S Kobuladze 5 June 29, 1984 Conductor - A Ziuraitis Choreography - M Petipa, revised version by Yu Grigorovich Designer - S Virsaladze. The Bolshoi website lists their current production from 2003 but it's the same Grigorovich/Virsaladze production just with some changes made (The White Lady, in a move I don't really like, is now completely gone from the ballet).

My question is when did the male ballet costume change to what it is now? IE for the Premier Danseur we have in classical ballet tights and a short shirt. I know that there used to always be more to the costume (as there was for women) from the old pictures--at the least some sort of shorts. I also vaguely remember Nijinsky causing a scandal when he decided the shorts limited his dancing and went without them in... Giselle? Les Sylphides? Some ballet. However I was surprised, looking at my mom's old programs, to find a Bolshoi program from the early 60s where the men still had quite old fashioned outfits. Does anyone know around what era this changed? Thanks guys for any details--I'm a theatre major and costuming is my elective and I was hoping to do something on dance/ballet costuming.

I've noticed that about the Bolshoi--there's definetly an era there where, particularly for revivals of the classics, you can find out next to nothing. I really think it's one of the most depressing thoughts I can think of re the current state of ballet that these works probably won't be performed again and even more likely won't be filmed. Sigh. It's times liek these I wish I was a wealthy billionaire who could finance something

It's the Lezhnina. I actually wasn't aware there was another Kirov Beauty on DVD--amazon only lists the Kolpokova/Berezhnoi 1983 staging (which I love) and the 1989 Montreal filming which is out of print. Also, I found a video tape listing of the 1989 one and it lists it as MUCH longer than Amazon (which claims it's just over 2 hours) so that may be a mix up I remember there being on videotape--or at least on tv a 1970s version with Kolopokova as well, but I don't think this made it to DVD. Thanks for your help!

Shame, although that seems to be a problem with a lot of Bolshoi ballets on film particularly those Grigorovich stagings... (Even more disappointing is going through old threads on here and readying that around 2004 they said that filmings of the reconstructed Kirov Sleepign Beauty and Bayaderer were very likely to happen "very soon" )

Lotsa great discussion here, but I find this quote particularly interesting. While I think putting Minkus and Adam down as "bad" music is a bit harsh (along with Pugni I kinda go back and forth about what I think of their work but certainly a part of me loves every second of Bayadere--albeit I'd probably never listen to it without the ballet like I do Tchaikovsky, Glazunov or Prokofiev). But what's odd to me and seems lazy is putting Delibes here. Delibes was NOT the typical ballet composer who "churned them out" (even if his first ballet was co writing La Source with Minkus) and indeed no less than Tchaikovsky spoke very highly of both Coppelia and Sylvia saying when he saw Sylvia in France it was the first time he went to a ballet that was staged badly but where all the pleasure and interest lay in the orchestra pit--he goes on at some length of how amazing the score is, and how he'll be reading it over, and bemoans (in the way Tchaikovsky likes to be self deprecating) that Swan Lake will never compare.

Right--but I'd say one reason the Dance of the Hours is a success is because the animated forms DO appear to have weight (or lack of), etc. When dancers were simply rotoscoped to be Gene Kelly's partners in Invitation, even though rotoscoping is just tracing over real dancers, for some reason there is a complete lack of sense of weight--this is why it's not a success for me. I'm trying to think of some other examples of ballet in animation, but I'm blanking...

I can't think of too much technical ballet, animated that sticks in my memory. I do think the Dance of the Hours in Fantasia is hysterical and gets osme of the ballet parody spot on (they actually filmed Ballet Russes de Monte Carlos dancers for test film) and always liked the fairies dancing to Waltz of the Flowers in the same film which is gorgeously animated. Not quite ballet but there's the animated dance with Gene Kelly in Invitation to the Dance--I believe the dancing was all rotoscoped completely though and it suffers a bit from that. Not animation, but I'm a huge fan of the famous 1970s Japanese manga (comic book series) Swan by Kyoko Ariyoshi. Most of it is translated into English--it's about a young ballerina but is a pretty realistic view and has amazingly drawn scenes of ballet dance which give the illusion of movement.