Tapfan

Did Roxander perform Neopolitan with Takumi Miyake? They both have lovely, clean technique and explosive jumps which should complement each other nicely.

Weren't they performing at BAM before they left for SoCal? Why commission Ratmansky to create a new Nutcracker if they weren't sure they'd have a venue? I thought Nutcrackers were the lifeblood of classical companies. And what did they do in December in the past? Just not perform the Nutcracker? Just sayin'. If ANY city should be able to support two major productions, you'd think it would be New York.

Since ABT hightailed it to SoCal, I wondered why can't a city the size of New York support two Nutcrackers? Both ABT's and NYCB's productions are critically acclaimed. And the Los Angeles area now has two Nutcrackers. Is it the same reason that New York couldn't support two opera companies?

Undoubtedly this is true. But that still doesn't account for failure to recruit from the pool of older students who HAVE committed to pursuing a life in dance. They certainly exist. Why aren't more of them studying at SAB?

Absolutely. No disagreement from me on that. For instance, I know that Katherine of Aragon was a blue-eyed redhead. And "Latino" as an indication of color and/or race is meaningless, despite the fact that it's generally used as an identifier for brown people, in the U.S. And even in a country like Mexico that many people in the U.S. assume is a population made up primarily of Mestizos, there are many people who identify as white. Look at the film "Roma" that went out of it's way to make sure the audience knew that the priviledged family that the main character worked for, was white and that she as an indigenous woman, decidedly, wasn't. When I mentioned the fact that some Puerto Ricans who obviously have African ancestry - I'm talking skin darker than mine AND dreads - identify as white, I wasn't saying that there are no white Puerto Ricans. There are white Puerto Ricans just like there are white and Asian Jamaicans. My point was that how one racially identifies isn't always based on how you look. It's personal. So when people refer to a ballet company as being diverse in COLOR or RACE based on the number of Latinos that they have, it isn't very accurate.

Yes. But every time I think I have handle on this issue, someone from the Latin community comes in and tells me something different. I hear contraditions from learned people all the time. Truly.

I couldn't agree more. But some people twist themselves in to pretzels to claim him as Latino, I assume because he ran for president and they admire him. Of course. But I once got into a lengthy discussion with someone who seemed knowledgeable on the subject, who insisted that you don't have to come from the Western hemisphere or have Latin American heritage to be Latino. Cruz comes from a Spanish-speaking country, Spanish has its roots in Latin, and all people whose primary language derives from Latin are technically, Latinos, including French-speakers. This person was dismissive of the term "Hispanic" and felt it was a pejorative. Yes, there's the rub. And the explanations that there ARE and have been MANY non-white Latinos and other people-of-color at City Ballet is something that makes some of us wonder just what is meant by "many." I hadn't thought about that, but it's true. Lupita is a Mexican citizen so she's a Latina, but not in the way most Americans or even most Mexicans would think of Latinas. Navigating the complexities of Latino identity in a respectful way, is difficult even for people who ARE Latino. Imagine how difficult it is for the rest of us.

Since ABT hightailed it to the West Coast, Is City Ballet the only company in New York with a traditional production of The Nutcracker?

I understand. It's also been explained to me that place of origin or nationality is more important than labels like " Latino" for some folks. But agreement on identifying subgroups like race within the Latino community can at best be called fluid and is very, very, controversial. I know kids within the same family who identify as people of color while their parents identify as white. For instance, many Puerto Ricans who obviously have African ancestry still identify as white. So it depends on which country or nationality in the Latino community you're taliking about and even the individual person, when thinking about how people identify. It's complicated. For instance, Spanish actress Penelope Cruz - who incidentally studied ballet - identifies as both a Latina and a white woman. So if she was dancing with NYCB, she'd make the company more diverse if you're talking about ethnicity or nationality but if you're talking about race, she wouldn't. ( And yes I do know that NYCB has at least one Spanish national as a dancer. ) Mitt Romney whose name should be in the encyclopedia next to the term - "white guy "- angered SOME in the Latino community because he didn't claim his Latino roots when he ran for president. It seems his father having been born in a Mormon colony in Mexico, made Mitt Latino in the eyes of SOME Latinos and they took it as an insult that he never mentioned that fact. It was as if it was a source of shame. So if Mitt Romney is considered Latino due to his heritage, then it obviously is an ethnicity and not a race in the eyes of some folks.

That's the reason I don't get the lack of diversity. Attending Summer Intensives should give the teachers access to a whole range of talented student dancers who are good enough to attend SAB, including many who are people of color and a particularly large number who are of Asian descent. Were non-white students just not auditioning for SAB summer intensives all these years? Was City Ballet's repution for being excessively insular make students of color not want to try? I honestly don't think there was some evil conspiracy to keep the company overwhelmingly white despite there being talented dancers of color out there. But I DO think that for the longest time, diversity just wan't a priority at NYCB. And I understand the feelings of those who say merit alone should be all that matters. But that assumes that there can be no talented people of color out there who could bloom if given the chance. When speaking about the low numbers of black females who attend SAB, Kay Mazzo said that was one of the reasons they were trying to get support to local ballet schools that train large numbers of minority students. She said that when it came auditioning, many black females just weren't where they needed to be. But that doesn't explain the lack of Asian females. And a a few over several years isn't much.

I thought we were primarily discussing racial diversity. Despite the fact that in the U.S., the word is frequently used to refer to people who identify as brown, according to my Latino friends, the term is actually an ethnicity not a race. Many people who identify as Latino also identify as white.

Wasn't Ashley Bouder pretty advanced in her training before she started attending SAB? And Tiler Peck and Quinn Starner were comp kids.

A zillion years ago when I first encountered Ballet Alert, I asked why City Ballet had so few Asian dancers when practically all other companies - large and small - had significant numbers. It was as strange to look at a ballet company roster in the West and see no Asians, as it would be to see no Asians at elite colleges and universities. Some members suggested that people from Asia and the Asian diaspora were like most other ballet dancers, trained in Vagonova technique and thus, had cut themselves off from being considered for dancing at a Balanchine company. But this explanation seemed unlikely to me considering the fact that most of the students who attend SAB summer intensives, have been training in the Vagonova, French or Cecchetti styles. But props to NYCB for finally making progress on hiring and promoting talented dancers who happen to be Asian.

I totally agree.

No, it doesn't mean you're a failure because you don't get promoted to soloist. But promotion out of the corp-de-ballet is ONE measure of progress of racial diversity in this elite art form, an art form that not so long ago, was deliberately and unashamedly closed to many black women. (See documentary clips of Delores Browne, Raven Wilkerson and Joan Myers Brown under the heading "Blacks in Ballet" on Youtube) I think some folks are particulary disappointed with City ballet because it was assumed that because of the Arthur Mitchell promotion to principal, they would be one of the first to train, hire and promote deserving black women dancers. Instead, they lagged way behind other, more staid companies. In fact, for an uncomfortably long time, in SOME quarters, they had a reputation for near-hostility towards black female dancers.

Hutsell isn't on promo posters NOW. But she was on a poster a few years ago. It led me to believe that she was moving up in the company. But nada. Boisson was on a promotional light display recently but she rarely dances roles outside the corp-de-ballet. English National Ballet faced a bit of a backlash a few years ago when they featured Precious Adams in a Swan Lake promotional poster. The publicity people said they used her because she has beautiful arms, but it led many patrons to assume she was dancing Odette/Odile when she wasn't. At the time, she wasn't a soloist. To some, it came across as exploitation. How is this different than putting the sole black female student at a ballet school on the cover of a school's brochure to sell it as diverse when it really isn't? I'd rather organizations be honest. Since Olivia Bell and India Bradley ocasionally get some notice in the press, I have high hopes that either of them will at least make it to soloist.

[Admin note: This discussion was raised in the NYCB Nutcracker 2023 thread and has been moved here.] Why does NYCB use photos on promotional posters of dancers like Olivia Boisson and Rachell Hutsell whom they don't or didn't promote? It can come across as exploitation. At least Olivia Bell an India Bradley occasionally get their featured work reviewed in The Times.

Yes, there's the DTH/Mitchell/Balanchine connection. And some ballet fans old enough to remember and to have seen both companies back in the day, claim that DTH danced Concerto Barroco better than NYCB. And lets not forget that many DTH dancers - at least in the past- trained at SAB, like Andrea Long and Tai Jimenez. But I'm not talking about a company like DTH with a strong Balanchine connection. I'm talking about all those dancers from companies who mostly dance Petipa.

Why are the AD's risking the anger of NYCB fans? I've always been told that there are Balanchine dancers and classical dancers and never the twain shall meet, and that the House of Balanchine likes it that way. Yes, I know that Ashley Bouder has guest starred with other companies doing classical roles. And I know that NYCB had occasionally hired dancers not trained in the Balanchine style like Christopher Wheeldon and Chun Wai Chan. But those are very rare occurances. Who is all this guest starring supposed to appeal to? Don't City ballet fans like the fact that their company's style is so unique? I thought this company was about keeping the bloodlines as pure as possible going back to the great man himself.

What a shockingly pleasant surprise.

Does anyone know hat happened to former ABT Studio Company member and ABT Apprentice Yuma Matsuura? His name isn't on the present roster. Did he leave the company? He's a very fine dancer.

I saw ABT Studio Company perform in person in Jefferson Parish, a suburb of New Orleans on November 10th. They are a uniformly strong troup of young dancers. Sasha Radetsky has quite the eye for talent. My personal favs are the charismatically explosive Takumi Miyake, wondrously versatile Madison Brown - whose career I've followed closely since she was a thirteen-year-old competion kid winning awards in both ballet and contemporary - and the old-school elegant young Spaniard Alejandro Valero Outlaw. Unfortunately, my other favorite amongst this group - Finnian Carmeci, didn't perform. Despite his youth, his skill as a partner is jaw-dropping. Already he and Kyra Coco make a fabulous dancing couple. Oh, and the new piece by Houston Thomas called "Knife's Edge" that was commisioned for the Studio Company, is smashing. A few have grumbled that it's a Forsythe rip-off, but if it is, it's a fantastic one.

Good to see that Takumi showed out last night. I find him to be every bit as talented as the much-discussed Jake. Truth be told, ALL the new ABT apprentices are super talented and look like future Principals. The Studio company is drowning in talent and is more fun to watch than the main company and has been for a few years.

There may not be any announcements of promotions within the company but 6 people from the Studio Company have been promoted to the rank of apprentices. Their names are Finnian Carmeci, Takumi Myiake, Sylvie Squires, Alejandro Velera Outlaw, Kyra Coco and Madison Brown. Bravo. They are all exceptional dancers. They can be seen in action on Youtube in in three pieces, "The Go Between" by Gemma Bond, "Concerto" by Kenneth McMillan and "Knife's Edge" by Houston Thomas. By the way, the promotion of Madison Brown and Kyra Cocco, now brings the number of self-identifying black or black/white biracial women in the company to six. For a major, predominately white, internationally recognized company, that is an astronomical number. I know there are those members of this forum who want to know, why do so many people of color - especially many black folks - make such a big deal out of milestones like this? Well, SOME black folks don't. But for those who do, it's because there are many black folks still walking this earth who never had such opportunities. It warms their hearts to see these young black women succeed in a field that they loved but that excluded them, many times, on purpose.

I think this young man is suffering from a case of selective outrage. He's pissed at ABT for what he perceives as racism but thinks that Russia is some sort of racial utopia? Russia, the country that defiantly told Western critics to eff-off when Russian ballet companies were criticized for still using blackface? A country with a storied ballet academy with world-class teachers that nonetheless told Precious Adams that she would have been cast in more roles during graduation performances, if she wasn't so dark? THAT country? And even though France gave refuge to black artists like James Baldwin, Nina Simone and Josephine Baker, they hardly have a spotless record when it comes to issues of race or particularly, issues of race in ballet. Paris Opera Ballet despite their constant embrace of new works, was shockingly slow to part with old "traditions" that have no place in today's society. Many of the powers-that-be felt that getting rid of blackface was just adhering to annoying and alien "woke" American ideology. And even some of the dancers sounded like they were straight outta the 1950's when talking about racial diversity. For example, Mathias Heymann said that black women were problematic because they stand out too much in the corps. I adore this man as a dancer, but that's heartbreaking to hear coming from him and to hear similar sentiments expressed by other veteran POB dancers. Yet according to Gabe, Paris is some artistic nirvana, Mr. Shayer's hardly the first dancer of ANY color to feel that he or she isn't sufficiently appreciated by his company for their talent and hard work. But if he's so insulted by his treatment at ABT, why doesn't he quit? Surely someone as talented as he seems to think he is, would find work quickly. Yet he stays and complains publicly. He also subtly implies that other black dancers at ABT are Uncle Toms because they aren't outraged at black programming like he is. I'm no apologist for ABT but I know enough about the world to know that even when they have the very best of intentions, NO ballet company has this color diversity thing all figured out. In fact, it's still up for debate amongst SOME ballet people as to the very value of racial diversity in companies. And these folks state that merit should be the only thing that matters, as if there was no subjectivity in an ART FORM like ballet where people may or may not be hired because they are tall, short, good jumpers, musical, have a body type that the AD favors or big, articulate, feet. ABT and even City Ballet seem to be making good faith efforts to increase minority enrollment in their schools even when it comes to those " problematic black females. And I honestly don't see students bothering to attend if they think their chances of completing their training, entering the company and advancing are zero because of their color. I never quite understood what the black professional dancers from predominately white companies who gather for the Theresa Ruth Howard directed Mobballet symposiums got out of it. Hadn't they reached their goal of mastering and getting hired to perform in an artform that they loved against all the odds? Wasn't that enough? But after hearing many of them talk about it being one of the most rewarding experiences of their lives, I understood. Many had gone through years and years of training and then years of professional dancing during which they were the ONLY black person around. (Most Black dancers DON'T train at the DTH, Collage or Ballet Black schools.) Even if you love something desperately, even if you have a firm sense of self, and even if you have no interest in being thought of as a "black dancer", being the only black person can sometimes make you feel very isolated. So meeting other people who share your passion, and who've had similar experiences, can be quite comforting. And dancing pieces with other black artists can give them a real feeling of belonging that energizes them when they return to their companies. This is more common that you might think. Even the wonderous Guillaume Diop from supposedly "non color-obsessed" France, spoke movingly about how comforting it felt to attend an Alvin Ailey school ballet summer intensive when he was training. He said that he surprised himself with how much he enjoyed being around black ballet people who by their very existence, helped to vanquish any feelings that he didn't belong. For those people who say they are so self-assured and free from seeing color that they don't need to see black dancers or creations in ballet for encouragement, I say, " Good for you. But not everyone is Superman. In fact, most of us aren't. And we aren't weak in wanting to see and acknowledge black representation. So Shayer just doesn't get it. His fellow black dancers who embraced a black ballet creation, weren't ghettoizing the art, they were expanding it. Because they enjoyed dancing in a piece by a black dancemaker doesn't mean they were rejecting classical ballet or allowing themselves to be put in a box. If they were, why would they be dancing for a mostly white company?