Which "Giselle" DVD should I buy?

[Helene]

I re-watched the Fracci/Bruhn Giselle on the plane from Frankfurt yesterday -- Lufthansa! -- and while I agree this isn't the first version I would recommend, it is the second, despite the infuriating camera work, particularly during the Peasant Pas de Deux. Eleanor D'Antuono's performance in it was fantastic. (I can't tell if Ted Kivitt's was, because of all of the cuts.) Toni Lander was such a fine Myrtha, a bloodless avenger, and Bruce Marks' Hilarion is not to be missed.

What impressed me most on this viewing was that despite Bruhn's naturally aristocratic presence, he was the most convincing Albrecht in purely dance terms: the key to being accepted as a villager was to dance like one, not in mannerisms or winks, but in Bournonville terms, as an equal, grounded partner. That made the dancing in Act II, with grander jumping variations and partnering more akin to a cavalier, a dramatic contrast.

[richard53dog]

I re-watched the Fracci/Bruhn Giselle on the plane from Frankfurt yesterday -- Lufthansa! -- and while I agree this isn't the first version I would recommend, it is the second, despite the infuriating camera work, particularly during the Peasant Pas de Deux. Eleanor D'Antuono's performance in it was fantastic. (I can't tell if Ted Kivitt's was, because of all of the cuts.) Toni Lander was such a fine Myrtha, a bloodless avenger, and Bruce Marks' Hilarion is not to be missed.

What is sad is this version horrible all the others away except of the horrible camera work. Fracci's second version is tradtional and sadly past her best , with her cheating on the steps. I saw her first in 1969 and I thought she was wonderful.

The later version

[miliosr]

I doubt any cut footage from the Fracci/Bruhn Giselle still exists but, if it were to turn up someday, it would be interesting to see a recut version of the film with any cuts to the dancing restored and some of the more bizarre non-dancing inclusions (cutaways to people eating fruit/cheese, extended close-ups of Terry Orr in the crowd) excised. (The peasant pas in general and Ted Kivitt's solos in particular would really benefit from this.)

[cubanmiamiboy]

If you like Nureyev and Fracci there is also this DVD, which has been registered 'live' in 1980 at Teatro dell'Opera di Roma.

http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album....album_id=104354

I love it very much.

I'm really interested to hear some comments on this version...BTW, the more i rewatch the tasteful Besmertnova (oh, so lovely and feathery... )/Lavrowsky production and compare it to some modern hyperextended "Giselles" ( ), the more convinced i am to leave it as #1 on my list)

[canbelto]

The best advice I can give about the Fracci/Nureyev Giselle is: don't get it. It's a sad document of two declining dancers. The production values are shoddy. Fracci's dancing has become leaden -- she fails in the hyperexposed moments of the second act. Nureyev too looks exhausted and his dancing has become sloppy. Both of them milk the applause -- Nureyev at one point gets up off the ground to take a bow, and then collapses again. But compared to their earlier films (Fracci's film with Bruhn, Nureyev's film with Seymour and the clips of him dancing with Fonteyn) this performance is very disappointing.

[cubanmiamiboy]

The best advice I can give about the Fracci/Nureyev Giselle is: don't get it. It's a sad document of two declining dancers. The production values are shoddy. Fracci's dancing has become leaden -- she fails in the hyperexposed moments of the second act. Nureyev too looks exhausted and his dancing has become sloppy. Both of them milk the applause -- Nureyev at one point gets up off the ground to take a bow, and then collapses again. But compared to their earlier films (Fracci's film with Bruhn, Nureyev's film with Seymour and the clips of him dancing with Fonteyn) this performance is very disappointing.

Wow canbelto...how sad. I adore Nureyev, but i must observe i'm not particulary enamoured with his Albretch in the Bavarian production, unless i just focus on his wonderful technique and leave the characterization work behind. Thank you for your advisement. I hate to see fading performances, particulary when one loves the performers. I guess i can only tolerate this sour taste coming from my beloved Mme.Alonso , in which i, despite her late shaky performances, always find an unbelievable glimpse of artistry and now forgotten old school glamour that still enchantes me ...

[Saltarello]

The best advice I can give about the Fracci/Nureyev Giselle is: don't get it. It's a sad document of two declining dancers. The production values are shoddy. Fracci's dancing has become leaden -- she fails in the hyperexposed moments of the second act. Nureyev too looks exhausted and his dancing has become sloppy. Both of them milk the applause -- Nureyev at one point gets up off the ground to take a bow, and then collapses again. But compared to their earlier films (Fracci's film with Bruhn, Nureyev's film with Seymour and the clips of him dancing with Fonteyn) this performance is very disappointing.

Actually both Fracci and Nureyev were not at the top of their possibilities. She is 44 and he 42, but i love this Giselle beyond the technical skill of the dancers. The 'pathos' in this Giselle is extraordinary to me.

The final part of Act II is available on YouTube. (Search on "giselle fracci nureyev")

[innopac]

Actually both Fracci and Nureyev were not at the top of their possibilities. She is 44 and he 42, but i love this Giselle beyond the technical skill of the dancers. The 'pathos' in this Giselle is extraordinary to me.

Saltarello, I quoted this to an 83 year old friend of mine and she said,

"He's a man who sees more than just the dancing. I love him for that comment."

[87Sigfried87]

The best advice I can give about the Fracci/Nureyev Giselle is: don't get it. It's a sad document of two declining dancers.

Imagine that Fracci is unfortunately still performing some ballets here in Italy,as she is director of the Opera of Rome.People still waste much money to see her dancing.It's crazy.If she was a declining dancer at the time the dvd was filmed imagine what she IS right now...more than declined...and compared to some terrific dancers as Zakharova,with hyper gifted bodies....the question coming to my mind is only one: what is she doing still on stage?can't she retire with honour and leave the place to younger and better dancers?do we want to see an old lady trying to stay on her points or do we want to remember her as she was at her time?Then let's admit...she was good if you see her in the contest of dancing 30-40 years ago....but now she wouldn't probably even be soloist,as the aesthetic and the dancing itself is now very different.I'd like to remeber her as the great performer she WAS.

[Azulynn]

I believe Carla Fracci only dances character parts made for older dancers, probably mostly mime. It's unfair to compare her to Svetlana Zakharova - they're obviously not dancing the same roles at this point...

[cubanmiamiboy]

Imagine that Fracci is unfortunately still performing .

Is fortunate that she existed.

and compared to some terrific dancers as Zakharova,with hyper gifted bodies.

No, of course there's no comparisson. Mme. Fracci is a "Prima Ballerina Assoluta", a Ballet Grand Dame, a living legend. ..Miss.Z, a "hyper gifted body", as you properly stated.

...the question coming to my mind is only one: what is she doing still on stage?.

"When i'm on the stage, even standing, i feel being at home. This is the only place where a dancer belongs: the stage". Mme. Alonso ...

do we want to see an old lady trying to stay on her points .

I always thank God that i could see Mme. Alonso's magistral late performances, being totally blind. Every one of them left a deep impact on my mind and soul, with its artistry, elegance, royalty, magnificence and old time glamour...These Dames are rare entities from another time, when Ballet was about gracefulness and distintion...and is tragic that we're in the path to loose all this in the sake of gymnastics...Don't only focus on the "old lady trying to stay on her points"...instead, look beyond the physical aspect and try to surround yourself in the magical spell of these rare performers and their experience...(and they have aquired some, don't you think...?)

or do we want to remember her as she was at her time?.

if you were lucky enough to had seen her live in her prime, maybe...did you?

dancing itself is now very different.

I know...can't wait for the inclusion of the new category "Ballet" in the upcoming Olimpic Games.

[87Sigfried87]

Dance is young.I hate old people not admitting that their youth and their good times are over.If she were the person of class she feels,she would have just retired with honour,admitting that she has done a great career,she has given the public more than enough and leave the public the remind of her best performances,not of the worsts.Maria Callas was a person of class;when she understood her voice was no more the perfect one she used to have,she just retired and sang no more.Look at Ferri this year.she retired with class even if could dance for many years more.The impression of Fracci I have is of a lady who is morbidly attached to her role and isn't able to get away and stay at home.Many dancers are morbid about that.Many of them go crazy when they get old and have to leave the stage.I personally know many.But that's insane.

One of my teachers when i was in the ballet school was a wonderful ballerina at Scala.At her 35,she was at the top of her possibility and she decided to retire,to have children and do something else.Just because she wanted to leave at her best moment.I admire her so much.One has to admit that it's time to get away when the body starts declining.For sure Fracci does character roles but she is just....old!nothing against,but really it's annoying to see her still on stage.When they tell me:"there's Carla in this show" i just answer:"no please!once again!".I quote another ballerina: Luciana Savignano.She danced at the prime of Aida last year at Scala and she still performs.She was like a mummy.Awful!grand battements hardly at 45°,decadent skin,insane thin body.And you know what's grotesque?she performed in another show Selene,the princess of the moon with some of my friends of the Scala ballet school.And the guys were supposed to be the 3 pretendants of Selene.She at her 60s or more,and them in their 16s.Anything weird?

It's the problem of people of a certain age who want to behave as teenagers and do their same things.I find it ridiculous.That's my opinion.No polemics;-)

[Mme. Hermine]

so let me get this straight, you acknowledge that carla fracci is performing character parts, but your main objection is not that the parts are beyond her but that she is old and that because of her age you don't believe she should be on stage at all, even in parts that are appropriate?

[volcanohunter]

Maria Callas was a person of class;when she understood her voice was no more the perfect one she used to have,she just retired and sang no more.

Oh, but she did. And the results of her "comeback" tour with Giuseppe di Stefano were awful beyond imagining. The last impression she left with audiences often resembled a rusty, sputtering faucet.

[canbelto]

Back to Giselles, VAI recently released something called "The Bolshoi Ballet" which is a film of the Bolshoi's wildly successful tour in 1956. Included is a truncated (1 hour) "Giselle" with Galina Ulanova. Some of Giselle's best dancing is cut (the Spessivtseva solo, Giselle's first encounter with Myrtha, the beautiful first duet with Albrecht in which her spirit touches him for the first time) but it's still the only video document we have of Ulanova's legendary Giselle.

[cubanmiamiboy]

Dance is young. but she is just....old! it's annoying to see her still on stage.When they tell me:"there's Carla in this show" i just answer:"no please!once again!"..I find it ridiculous.

[aurora]

Dance is young. but she is just....old! it's annoying to see her still on stage.When they tell me:"there's Carla in this show" i just answer:"no please!once again!"..I find it ridiculous.

Seriously.

There are legitimate complaints about dancers dancing difficult roles once their ability has been diminished.

But why would one want to ban anyone from the stage in character roles, simply because they are "old"??

Frederick Franklin is still out there and kicking at 90+, and I wouldnt want it any other way.

I also think you (dancerboy87) said Fracci was good for her time, but wouldn't be a major talent today.

As someone who never got to see her live but adores her in Giselle with Bruhn, I'd have to disagree. There are dancers who I would agree with that assessment of, but Fracci (and Cubanmiamiboy's beloved Alonzo) are not among them.

[chrisk217]

While I deplore the indiscriminate use of extension in classical repertory and would take the Fracci/Bruhn Giselle over Zakharova's any day, I do understand a little bit where dancerboy87 is coming from.

I've heard the same complaint, quite unprompted, from two Italian friends. No one would or should object to Fracci doing mime roles but from what I hear she was dancing pointe roles in Excelsior, spectre of the rose etc till a few years ago (2000?) She also appears frequently on the media, festivals etc. If I remember well she was planning to appear in Nijinsky's Jeux as recently as last summer. I know this is not a classical role but however little dancing there may be in it I have some trouble picturing Fracci at 70+, as a young tennis player.

At around 2000 she was appointed to direct the La Scala ballet but didn't accept because it would not afford her the opportunity to dance. I'm not exactly sure what her proposed repertory would be. Even if she did not propose to dance en pointe, at that time it was hard to imagine that as AD she would not favor productions with roles fitting her abilities and that she would not divert to them resources that should perhaps be best spend elsewhere. I think the dancers organized some sort of protest over it.

There may be a parallel to Nureyev whose presence in the spotlight, from some point on, had more to do with the cult of personality than with the power of his dancing.

This has created a slightly intolerant climate against her and what's more may have cast her in the role of the old-timer who stops progress. I know Bolle gave an interview where he railed against all the ills of italian dance and among other things he claimed she was an egoist for still being on stage.

So there's a backstory here that may explain why some people in Italy feel somewhat tired of seeing Fracci on stage. And I imagine a young dancer like dancerboy87, just out of school and struggling, would particularly resent seeing precious and limited resources being spent by/on a ballerina who has had many many many years in the limelight.

I say this with the greatest respect for Fracci whom I love in the old videos. dancerboy87, you are very young and must be excused for having the cruelty of youth but I have to say I was shocked by your blunt way of putting things

[cubanmiamiboy]

But why would one want to ban anyone from the stage in character roles, simply because they are "old"??

ageism...?

Frederick Franklin is still out there and kicking at 90+, and I wouldnt want it any other way.

Keep it on, boy!!

As someone who never got to see her live but adores her in Giselle with Bruhn, I'd have to disagree. There are dancers who I would agree with that assessment of, but Fracci (and Cubanmiamiboy's beloved Alonso) are not among them.

Amen

[87Sigfried87]

I've heard the same complaint, quite unprompted, from two Italian friends. No one would or should object to Fracci doing mime roles etc but from what I hear she was dancing pointe roles in Excelsior, spectre of the rose etc till a few years ago (2000?) She also appears frequently on the media, festivals etc If I remember well she was planning to appear in Nijinsky's Jeux as recently as last summer. I know this is not a classical role but however little dancing there may be in it I have some trouble picturing Fracci at 70+, as a young tennis player.

This has created a slightly intolerant climate against her and what's more may have cast her in the role of the old-timer who stops progress. I know Bolle gave an interview where he railed against all the ills of italian dance and among other things he claimed she was an egoist for still being on stage.

That's the point.Maybe outside Italy you don't know anything about that.She appears anywhere,she still wants to dance roles as the ones you quoted....it's unbeliavable.Bolle was right when he said so.Then let's admit that she still dances in Rome because of her husband who is a producer....at Scala nobody would have allowed her to dance.About my blunt ways....well,dance is blunt towards us....and we are blunt towards It.I didn't mean to offend anyone but,as you said,she created a climate of anger and intolerence...you can talk to any Italian dancer,he would just say the same.:-)

[cubanmiamiboy]

There may be a parallel to Nureyev whose presence in the spotlight, from some point on, had more to do with the cult of personality than with the power of his dancing.

Well, yes, this is totally right. But, let's face it...how many times have we balletomanes felt under the spell of the "Personality Cult" phenomenom...a lot, i would say. Yes, Rudy's () followers among them. Also Fonteyn's. See, i think this is a more complex phenomenom that what it looks like. As we start to learn about ballet, and its intrincate paths, we start learning not only about technique, but also about everything that surround this world. The Ego, the fame, the decandence, the physical decay...and also, we start to learn to venerate our favorite dancers beyond hyperextensions. Maybe i do come from a country where personality cult is a common practice, (maybe i'm brainwashed, who knows), but there's something i know for sure. When i was a teen, starting to watch ballet, and my older friends would tell me "Tonight Alicia is dancing", and i would notice of how respectfully admired was this "old lady trying to get on pointes", i knew there was something to look at...and i did. Years passed by, and she continued dancing, and i continued learning, and at the end, when she could barely stand still, me and my friends, (along with the hundreds of cubans at the theatre), would just stare at...let's say,her hand's movements, or that amazing "Port de Bras", or the subltle magnificent accent on that perfect romantic pose that lasted less than a second...and THAT was a master class, an incredible opportunity to learn from a Prima, and yes, i was learning...I still learn, everytime i watch my beloved Mme. Alonso.s videos, not comercially released, some of them showing her veeeeeeeeery old and shaky, . Yes, there were jokes. My friends and i would joke during the intermission about her and her age, but those were OUR jokes, made within her hardcore fans domains, never malicious, in a very low tone, so nobody would listen...and then, back inside, we would just SCREAM until we lost our voices at the infinate courtain calls while she, again, would offer one of her best classes ever...hot to take a proper old fashioned Ballet Russe-style bow, BRAVO ALICIA!!!!!! over and over and over.and over ...IMO, I was not only applauding her for that night performance. It was also for all the happiness that she and her Company and had given me for years. I will never have enough ways to comunicate my infinate appreciation for somebody who was responsible for some of my best precious memories of my adolescence, and THAT, is something that doesn't come with every hyperextended dancer.

Oh, well, call me crazy...

Dancerboy, watch Fracci, while she still exists...

[87Sigfried87]

Dancerboy, watch Fracci, while she still exists...

If I want to see just a good actor,mostly not dancing,or too old to do it,I go to the cinema,not to the theatre;it's less expensive....

[cubanmiamiboy]

Dancerboy, watch Fracci, while she still exists...

If I want to see just a good actor,mostly not dancing,or too old to do it,I go to the cinema,not to the theatre;it's less expensive....

You got it then, boy...good luck