Balanchine's Ballets -- Has Performance Quality Dropped?

[Jack Reed]

I'd just like to urge the New Yorkers here to avail themselves of an opportunity to broaden their experience of Balanchine performance by attending at least one SAB Workshop performance the first weekend in June, if they haven't already thought of that.

Of Balanchine, there's only a performance of Western Symphony this year, but I'd say, go and compare and constrast the dancing there with what you see at NYCB, because comparisons are often revealing and often help you to get more out of whatever you're doing, and this is an opportunity you don't have the rest of the year.

In spite of being somewhat "logistically challenged" by living here, I've often done that myself, and I've always greatly enjoyed it, especially the ballets prepared by Suki Schorer, and also by Susan Pillare.

For further information, call 212-769-6600 or visit www.sab.org.

But as to the main topic of this thread, my answer to the question is, Yes, performance quality has dropped, and my reason for giving that answer is that, as far as I can tell, NYCB seldom if ever dances Balanchine's ballets as he had them danced, a way I consider part of the ballets themselves, about as much a part as the steps are, many of which, I'm told by people with sharper eyes and better memories than I have, have also disappeared. I'm sorry, oberon, but I don't think NYCB is Balanchine's company, if it doesn't look like it.

[Guest nycdog]

I had thought we at least came to the conclusion in this thread that it wasn't fair to make sweeping generalizations on the basis of a fair performance now and again, since probably MORE of those occurred when B was around.

For example Ashley Bouder is handling the lead in Ballo Della Regina very well lately isn't she? She's not leaving out large numbers of steps? Didn't Ansanelli do Stars wonderfully? The list could go on and on...

The only really negative thing this season were those weird ballets they did in the Gala, but the house was packed and they raised 2 million dollars.

One subject that particularly interests me is the sort of class that Balanchine gave, and how it was different from what goes on today. I saw a wonderful video of the New York Choreographic Institute's BALANCHINE SYMPOSIUM from 23 March 2004, with Francia Russell, Kent Stowell, Violette Verdy, Peter Martins, Barbara Horgan, and moderator Richard Tanner.

Peter Martins talked at one point about what Balanchine's class was like, "By the time I joined the New York City Ballet, we did not, Balanchine did not have 3 hours classes. It was like, just as you said, 50 minutes and he was usually 10 minutes late. I think I'm recorded as having said I didn't like the classes but it's not that I didn't like them, I, it was very difficult for me to join a company and he would give a combination to girls for like 20 minutes and we'd stand at the bar in the back--boys. I'm sure you remember that Kent, and then all of a sudden he'd see a boy back there and he'd go oh, boys, of course, come on, and he'd say now let's see, double tour to grande plié, remember that [laughter]? double tour to grande plié, you stood there for 25 minutes you were stone cold [laughter] and I just couldn't do it my knees popped and everything and so little by little I found myself going to the school to take Stanley's [Williams] classes because it was sort of 'real' class. So I sort of lost out on Balanchine's classes for some years."

[kfw]

I had thought we at least came to the conclusion in this thread that it wasn't fair to make sweeping generalizations on the basis of a fair performance now and again, since probably MORE of those occurred when B was around. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It seems to be the near consensus among those who saw the company in Balanchine's day that NYCB's level of performance of his ballets has dropped dramatically since. Time may have burnished some of their memories, but at least these people have memories to judge by. It seems to me that for this reason they're the only ones qualified to judge.

[charlieloki]

One subject that particularly interests me is the sort of class that Balanchine gave, and how it was different from what goes on today. I saw a wonderful video of the New York Choreographic Institute's BALANCHINE SYMPOSIUM from 23 March 2004, with Francia Russell, Kent Stowell, Violette Verdy, Peter Martins, Barbara Horgan, and moderator Richard Tanner.

Peter Martins talked at one point about what Balanchine's class was like, "By the time I joined the New York City Ballet, we did not, Balanchine did not have 3 hours classes.  It was like, just as you said, 50 minutes and he was usually 10 minutes late.  I think I'm recorded as having said I didn't like the classes but it's not that I didn't like them, I, it was very difficult for me to join a company and he would give a combination to girls for like 20 minutes and we'd stand at the bar in the back--boys. I'm sure you remember that Kent, and then all of a sudden he'd see a boy back there and he'd go oh, boys, of course, come on, and he'd say now let's see, double tour to grande plié, remember that [laughter]? double tour to grande plié, you stood there for 25 minutes you were stone cold [laughter] and I just couldn't do it my knees popped and everything and so little by little I found myself going to the school to take Stanley's [Williams] classes because it was sort of 'real' class. So I sort of lost out on Balanchine's classes for some years."

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i was at that symposium and found martins to be very ungracious and negative toward balanchine, for whatever reasons -- i wished he had not been there, he spoiled the atmosphere of joy and appreciation

my thought was: where would he be today if balanchine had not employed him at nycb?

at abt? in denmark?

(i wish)

[Edited to delete irrelevant portions of quoted post.]

Edited May 19, 2005 by carbro

[Guest nycdog]

kfw wrote:

"It seems to be the near consensus among those who saw the company in Balanchine's day that NYCB's level of performance of his ballets has dropped dramatically since"

I don’t believe there’s any Balanchine work being performed this season in which the performance level has “dramatically declined.”

charlieloki asked:

“my thought was: where would he [Martins] be today if balanchine had not employed him at nycb?”

He’d have a Polsevogn (sausage cart) on Central Square in Copenhagen!

Polsevogn

Actually, he’d probably have a Peter Martins Ballet somewhere? Martins definitely loved B I didn’t want to quote too much of what he said at the Balanchine Symposium lest the moderators snip, but Martins went on to say with much affection that he came to always take Balanchine's class.

[Farrell Fan]

On this question, Barbara Newman writes in the current Ballet Review (Spring, 2005), "As for style, I don't want to debate whether the company can or cannot dance Balanchine's ballets as they "should" be danced, when the good news is that they are still danced because their guardians value what they show us about dance and about the dancers who perform them."

[Jack Reed]

But is she right, FF? I picked up the magazine because of your post, and I found her article peculiar. We have another forum for that kind of discussion, and here's a short-cut to it: http://ballettalk.invisionzone.com/index.p...29entry158929

[Mel Johnson]

Having been a NYCB watcher since the City Center days, I can say that the company did things wrong then, and does things wrong now. They're just different wrong things. About the only wrong things that are the same now as then are the universally lousy ability of the corps to make a straight and evenly-spaced line on the stage, or the inability of the men in the finale of "Stars and Stripes" to agree when they should all be in the air doing entrechat-six. It still looks a lot like popcorn.

[Jack Reed]

Popcorn? Oh, popcorn popping! Yes, very apt. (Tasty, too.)

[Alexandra]

Just to stir things up, since they're beginning to be calm I have an Anecdote.

I took two 16-year-old ballet students, innocent of the politics and history of the company, to a program of NYCB this past spring. This was the reaction after a very disappointing, shall we say, go at "Theme and Variations": Said one: "What do you think the artistic director says to them after a performance like that?" (On opening night, after an even more disappointing performance of the same ballet, a student I just happened to run into at intermisison asked, rather urgently, "What does an artistic director DO?")

Two months later, the class watched a video of "Stravinsky Violin Concerto" from the 1980s. "What company is that?" said one of the visitors. "New York City Ballet," I replied. 'THAT'S THE SAME COMPANY WE SAW AT THE KENNEDY CENTER? But they're so GOOD."

[Quiggin]

I saw Peter Boal, Albert Evans and Teresa Reichlen this spring in the Four Temperaments. They were just great, but their phrasing of movement seemed different than in the 1980s videos that Alexandra refers to. In Spring 2005 4Ts, the transitions through the forearms, wrists, and hands and ankles seemed more delicate, though still involving. What was missing was the conviction and angst of the corps. The friend I was with said they weren’t “menacing” enough.

For me what Balanchine is all about—and Fokine and Ashton aren’t—is an intense musical conversation between soloists and corps, foreground figures and background ones. It’s all about strong counterpoint and Constructivist angularity and bits of phrases being initiated by one group and finished off or vetoed by the other. This seems to happen less and less.

[carbro]

Oh, Quiggin, I agree so completely with your second paragraph!

I've been seeing 4T's since the mid-70s. I don't know if "angst" was ever an element. But there was an underlying sense of -- not quite danger, but maybe edginess? That's what's missing. It's been smoothed out. But I still think it looked much better this past season than it did three or four years ago. If it lacks "edge" (and I don't mean Amanda! ), at least it has power. Not quite enough, but some.

[oberon]

Maybe one of the "problems" we have, those of us who've been going for several years, is that we have seen these ballets too often. Maybe they are no longer as potent because we know what the next step is going to be and what direction the corps is going to move in, etc.

I do think 4 TEMPS has looked really good lately, and have seen things in the ballet that I never noticed before. The music to me is more lyrical than edgy...and extraordinarily beautiful. It clearly is a ballet that "speaks" to people, as I have experienced a sort of breathless silence among the audience at recent outings, as well as very enthusiastic applause for the interpreters.

[kfw]

I've been seeing 4T's since the mid-70s.  I don't know if "angst" was ever an element.  But there was an underlying sense of -- not quite danger, but maybe edginess?  That's what's missing.  It's been smoothed out. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I didn't see NYCB dance this ballet until 1999, but I noticed the same thing then and several times since. Miami City Ballet dances it with sort of tension I love in the NYCB video. Quiggin, thank you for that careful observation.

[jimmattimore]

I see that Amazon has Repertory in Review. They are offering new and 10 copies used at $39.99.

I hope this helps seekers. JIM

[bart]

Thanks, jimmatttimore, for the info re Repertory in Review.

[PetipaFan]

"I took two 16-year-old ballet students, innocent of the politics and history of the company, to a program of NYCB this past spring. This was the reaction after a very disappointing, shall we say, go at "Theme and Variations": Said one: "What do you think the artistic director says to them after a performance like that?" " -- Alexandra

I've just been wading through this long thread and read this I was wondering what they did that was so awful? 'like that' ?

[dewdrop]

"I took two 16-year-old ballet students, innocent of the politics and history of the company, to a program of NYCB this past spring. This was the reaction after a very disappointing, shall we say, go at "Theme and Variations": Said one: "What do you think the artistic director says to them after a performance like that?" " -- Alexandra

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'll take a stab at what the AD might say. How about this, 'Next time, I'll give you more notice!'

[PetipaFan]

I always like to read Robert Greskovic’s Dance column in the Wall Street Journal. At the end of June he wrote about the current and future state of NYCB:

"If New York City Ballet were as successful at looking forward as its recent run proved to be in looking back, the impact and importance of the company founded by the visionary and forward-looking George Balanchine would be more securely on the track often touted by its current director, Peter Martins..."

That's a fairly positive comment I thought! What he meant was he liked Jerome Robbins's 1958 “New York Export: Opus Jazz” which was revived.

But speaking of the current NYCB dancers, of the men he only singles out Jared Angle for praise and says of Ask la Cour that he “is capable in many ways, so long as his parts don't demand clean, classical dancing, which eludes him.”

Among the women, Greskovic praises Weese, Bouder, Fairchild, Reichlen and Hyltin, but seems not to care much for Sylve!

“One female dancer who has garnered accolades lately is the French-born and European-schooled Ms. Sylve. The fact that this glamorous-looking but nonexpansive dancer of uneven, old-fashioned technique has been variously hailed as a superlative Balanchine stylist tells me either that standards for watching Balanchine dancing are fading or that they were never understood in the first place... But that's another aspect of NYCB and its future fortunes." -- Robert Greskovic, Wall Street Journal, (Eastern edition), New York, N.Y., 29 Jun 2005, page D8.

I was surprised Greskovic said that Sylve has an 'old-fashioned technique' what is the sort of 'old fashion' he was referring to, a ‘European’ old style?

It’s not very helpful for Greskovic NOT to tell us precisely what displeases him about Sylve as she might benefit from his criticism if it were valid.

As though the ‘Balanchine Style’ were something so perfect that the differences individual dancers bring to it from their unique backgrounds is a lesser art than the ‘pure’ Balanchine we might expect to see from a SAB student?

I don’t think it’s correct to call Sylve ‘nonexpansive’ in Balanchine:

http://www.sofsylve.com/images/western-symphony-nycb1.jpg

I made a list of the current NYCB principals and the year of their promotion:

Kyra Nichols '79

Darci Kistler '82

Wendy Whelan '91

Miranda Weese '96

Yvonne Borrée '97

Maria Kowroski '99

Jennifer Ringer '00

Jennie Somogyi '00

Sofiane Sylve '03

Ashley Bouder '05

Megan Fairchild '05

Janie Taylor '05

And the men…

Damian Woetzel ’89

Nikolaj Hübbe ’92

Nilas Martins ’93

Philip Neal ’93

Albert Evans ’95

Charles Askegard ’98

Benjamin Millepied ’02

Sébastien Marcovici ’02

Stephen Hanna ’05

I hope I didn’t leave anyone out there are now 12 female and 9 male principals at NYCB?

It seems to me looking to the future the problem is definitely not Sylve but that new male talent is needed I suppose they will have to find an adult principal somewhere in the world to bring in? Who can they get?

[Helene]

It’s not very helpful for Greskovic NOT to tell us precisely what displeases him about Sylve as she might benefit from his criticism if it were valid. 

I'm a bit confused by this statement, since you quote Mr. Greskovic's description of Sylve earlier in your post: "glamorous-looking but nonexpansive dancer of uneven, old-fashioned technique."

You've said you disagree with the term "nonexpansive," which is certainly your right, but I don't think there's anything unclear about the criticism expressed.

[paulofnyc]

I will again make my prediction that some principles at ABT will get an invitation to join NYCB.

[paulofnyc]

...and I thought there would not be too much discussion on NYCB during the off season.

[PetipaFan]

“One female dancer who has garnered accolades lately is the French-born and European-schooled Ms. Sylve. The fact that this glamorous-looking but nonexpansive dancer of uneven, old-fashioned technique has been variously hailed as a superlative Balanchine stylist..." -- Robert Greskovic, Wall Street Journal, (Eastern edition), New York, N.Y., 29 Jun 2005, page D8.

"Sofiane Sylve dances with glorious virtuosity. Her musical phrases are sweeping, her pirouettes extravagant, and her leaps exultant. She looks like she could jump over a rainbow. Sylve has a clear affinity for Balanchine's choreography, but her background is European." -- Allegra Kent, Dance Magazine, February 2005.

I see Sofiane Sylve as Allegra Kent described her she's sweeping not nonexpansive and her European background is a great asset.

[beck_hen]

I will again make my prediction that some principles at ABT will get an invitation to join NYCB.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I wonder if you mean Danny Tidwell... ABTers are aghast that he is off the roster. Oops, not a principal, but a rising star.

Edited August 28, 2005 by beck_hen

[Helene]

I see Sofiane Sylve as Allegra Kent described her she's sweeping not nonexpansive and her European background is a great asset.

It sounds like Ms. Kent and Mr. Greskovic disagree.

There's very little in ballet or art of any kind where there is complete unanimity of analysis and opinion. If there were, we wouldn't have much to discuss .